Transcript of interview with Irene Fisher and Roberta Gang by Barbara Tabach, September 29, 2016

An Interview with Irene Fisher and Bobbie Gang An Oral History Conducted by Barbara Tabach Southern Nevada Jewish Heritage Project Oral History Research Center at UNLV University Libraries University of Nevada Las Vegas ©Southern Nevada Jewish Heritage Project University of Nevada Las Vegas, 2014 Produced by: The Oral History Research Center at UNLV - University Libraries Director: Claytee D. White Project Manager: Barbara Tabach Transcriber: Kristin Hicks Interviewers and Editors: Barbara Tabach, Claytee D. White 11 The recorded interview and transcript have been made possible through the generosity of a Library Services and Technology Act (LSTA) Grant. The Oral History Research Center enables students and staff to work together with community members to generate this selection of first- person narratives. The participants in this project thank University of Nevada Las Vegas for the support given that allowed an idea the opportunity to flourish. The transcript received minimal editing that includes the elimination of fragments, false starts, and repetitions in order to enhance the reader’s understanding of the material. All measures have been taken to preserve the style and language of the narrator. In several cases photographic sources accompany the individual interviews with permission of the narrator. The following interview is part of a series of interviews conducted under the auspices of the Southern Nevada Jewish Heritage Project. Claytee D. White Director, Oral History Research Center University Libraries University of Nevada Las Vegas m Preface Las Vegas has been home to Irene Fisher (1940 -) since the early 1970s. It felt like home as she connected with the Jewish community, including a dear friendship with Roberta ‘Bobbie’ Gang, who sits with her during this interview. During their oral history conversation, the seemingly common concerns of any mother are touched upon. In their case they were young Jewish women looking out for the well-being of their children. They cover a range of topics, from b’nai mitzvahs to Hanukkah to shopping in those years of raising children, being active in the community, and maintaining career paths. Irene begins by describing her ancestral background that includes parents who emigrated from Poland to New York. In New York she met and married a young doctor who she followed to Nellis Air Force Base. Irene was a recent graduate of Brooklyn Law School. In Las Vegas, though Irene did not practice law here, she immersed herself into civic contributions. Chief among those was with the Clark County Library District where she served on the board from 1975-1983. A major initiative was the Right to Read program. In addition, both women speak about their involvement with and fundraising for Sisterhood at Temple Beth Sholom and on the national level. Irene’s children are Stacy Fisher and Scott Fisher. For more information about Bobbie Gang, see the 2016 oral history interview of Roberta ‘Bobbie’ and Leonard Gang. IV Table of Contents Interview with Irene Fisher including Bobbie Gang September 29, 2016 in Las Vegas, Nevada Conducted by Barbara Tabach Preface...................................................................................iv Irene provides family ancestral background, parents bom in Poland and immigrated around 1937 to New York City; she was bom in 1940; grew up with two siblings in New York. Talks about moving to Las Vegas in early 1970s; husband (Barry) was a doctor at Nellis Air Force Base; Judaic background; making friends through Temple Beth Sholom and meeting her longtime friend Bobbie Gang there; Sisterhood....................................................................1 - 7 Sisterhood work led to her interest in art; more about Nellis Air Force living in Las Vegas at first; depending on each other to help with children; raising money for Sisterhood through art auctions...............................................................................7- 12 Discuss Boulevard Mall, Vegas Village, and local shopping of the 1980s; cooking for Passover. National Sisterhood meetings; recall 1978 Sayegh kidnapping from Temple Beth Sholom; being married to a doctor and working in his office.........................................13-20 Discuss Irene’s involvement with the Clark County Public Library District; mention David Kanter; Right to Read; served on Library Board from 1975-1983; on Credit Mangers Association, honored in 1996; attended Brooklyn Law School (1967 graduate). Talk about raising families in 1980s- 1990s in Las Vegas.....................................................................21-25 Mention early Temple Beth Sholom women leaders such as Etta Harmel, Sarah Salzman, Jayn Marshall, Faye Steinberg, kosher meals................................................26 - 30 Talk of their three children’s b’nai mitzvahs; integration of Jewish studies for girls during this era; role of women in general in services; mention Sandy Mallin, Flora Mason, Bonnie Kanter. How they might spend Christmas Day as Jews; Hanukkah; Purim................................31-39 Reflect on experiences with anti-Semitism; Rosh Hashanah story; Leo Wilner, executive director of Temple Beth Sholom; Cantor Kohn desire to form a women’s choir; Adele Baratz, Joan Shapiro, Susan Molasky mentioned. Discuss Jewish humor and famous Jewish comedians such as Henny Youngman, Jerry Lewis and Milton Berle; thoughts about their decades long friendship. . 40-44 v Southern Nevada Jewish Heritage Project UNLV University Libraries Use Agreement Name of Narrator: 'EEE/JE F/S/fEE-_________________________ Name of Interviewer: 13/1 f?15 fil? A FARfi/^rh__________________ We, the above named, give to the Oral History Research Center of UNLV, the recorded interview(s) initiated on '7- along with typed transcripts as an unrestricted gift, to be used for such scholarly and educational purposes as shall be determined, and transfer to the University of Nevada Las Vegas, legal title and all literary property rights including copyright. This gift does not preclude the right of the interviewer, as a representative of UNLV, to use the recordings and related materials for scholarly pursuits. I understand that my interview will be made available to researchers and may be quoted from, published, distributed, placed on the Internet or broadcast in any medium that the Oral History Research Center and UNLV Libraries deem appropriate including future forms of electronic and digital media. There will be no compensation for any interviews. Signature of Narrator CTa/LaJ-a^JL / f Date Signature of Interviewer Date Oral History Research Center at UNLV Libraries 4505 S. Maryland Parkway, Box 457010, Las Vegas, NV 89154-7010 702.895.2222 VI Southern Nevada Jewish Heritage Project UNLV University Libraries Use Agreement Name of Narrator: Name of Interviewer: We, the above named, give to the Oral History Research Center of UNLV, the recorded interview(s) initiated on dff - ZA'i "lb along with typed transcripts as an unrestricted gift, to be used for such scholarly and educational purposes as shall be determined, and transfer to the University of Nevada Las Vegas, legal title and all literary property rights including copyright. This gift does not preclude the right of the interviewer, as a representative of UNLV, to use the recordings and related materials for scholarly pursuits. I understand that my interview will be made available to researchers and may be quoted from, published, distributed, placed on the Internet or broadcast in any medium that the Oral History Research Center and UNLV Libraries deem appropriate including future forms of electronic and digital media. There will be no compensation for any interviews. Oral History Research Center at UNLV Libraries 4505 S. Maryland Parkway, Box 457010, Las Vegas, NV 89154-7010 702.895.2222 My name is Barbara Tabach and I’m working on the Southern Nevada Jewish Heritage project, which has brought me here with these two lovely ladies, Bobbie and Irene on September 29, 2016. I'm going to ask you to each state your name and spell it. We'll start with you, Irene. Irene Fisher; I-R-E-N-E, F-I-S-H-E-R. And Bobbie is joining us. Bobbie Gang; B-O-B-B-I-E, G-A-N-G. My formal name is Roberta. Well, I really am looking forward to this. I've heard a lot about you, Irene. We're going to start with —you said you were born and raised... In New York City. —in New York City. Do you know how your parents got to New York City? Were they born there themselves? Both of my parents were bom in Poland. My mother came on a ship that was allegedly fired upon. Actually we found some paperwork on it. They never hit the ship, but it was fired upon when she was leaving Warsaw. And your dad? My father came on another ship separately and he met her when she landed in the United States. So they were already married when they immigrated? Yes, they married in Poland. Do you remember what year approximately? Approximately 1937. And then you were born...? In New York City in 1940. 1 And how many siblings did you have? I have a brother and a sister. My sister was bom in 1942, Joan, J-O-A-N, and my brother in 1948, Joseph, J-O-S-E-P-H. What was it like to grow up in New York City? I have very fond memories. Most people don't have fond memories of their childhood, but I have great memories of growing up, playing around, having a younger sister and brother. We didn't fight very much at all. The biggest fight was who was going to wear the mittens or not wear the mittens when it was cold weather and snow, but that was about it. I had a good time. Why would you fight over the mittens? Because I was always losing them. My mother would pin them onto the bottom of the sleeve of my jacket so I couldn't lose them, finally, because, otherwise, it was with a piece of wool or yam throughout the jacket and around and so that the mittens would stay with the jacket, but I would manage to pull them off. What kind of neighborhood did you grow up in? A residential neighborhood, an apartment building. We lived on the first floor. It was a six-story building. There were apartments all over that area—well, not when I was first bom. When I was first bom there were some empty lots that were later built up. When I say empty lots, we used to play in the hills and valleys of them because they were big holes in the ground. I had a good time. I enjoyed growing up. I enjoyed Washington Heights, which is that area of Manhattan near the George Washington Bridge. What was your education like? I went to public school. I went to high school. I went to college. I went to secretarial school. I went to graduate school. Wherever they let me in, I went. 2 What did you like studying? I liked studying the law. I didn't do as well in it as I could have, but then I didn't like studying either. I enjoyed learning about the law, but I didn't like studying. So you told me a little bit ago, we figured out you came to Las Vegas in—what did we decide, Bobbie—1981? Yes. No, 1983 or— I thought the kids—Stacy was like a year and a half. Stacy was about a year and a half old when she came, yes. So that would be '81. That's close enough. So what brought you to Las Vegas? Unfortunately, the smartass answer is a car. My husband was at Nellis Air Force Base and he was in the Air Force before I got here. Just a couple of weeks he did basic training in Texas. I almost didn't recognize him because it was the first time ever I had seen him in a uniform. Oh, wow. So were the two of you married in New York City? We were married in New York City in a temple there. Was your upbringing religious or socially Jewish? How would you describe your connection with your spiritual Judaism? My mother kept a kosher home, if that means anything. We didn't go to temple often. We went on the High Holidays. My parents went on the High Holidays. My sister and I sort of disappeared on the High Holidays. They couldn't quite drag us to services; occasionally they did. I didn't like High Holidays then. I still don't like them now. I like them more as a social event rather than as a religious event. 3 When you got married did you have a traditional Jewish wedding? Yes, I did. Broke the glass and everything. Well, my late husband, who is still alive, did. (I'm sorry. I say that all the time and people find it very offensive, but I don't care.) It’s part of your humor. Yes, I've said it in front of him a couple of times, too. I don't think he found it funny. Should I dare ask how long you two were married? How long was I married? Thirty—no. Maybe thirty-one years; something like that; thirty-one, thirty-two years. Bobbie Gang: Sounds like it could have been, yes, because you renewed your vows on your twenty-fifth anniversary. Yes. And you were married a couple of years after that still. At least, yes, where we were still talking. Actually we spoke not too long ago before the holidays, before the almost holidays, which is, what, in two weeks, the High Holidays? Next week. So the move to Nellis Air Force Base: that was the first time you’d ever seen him in his uniform. When I saw him, when I got here. I drove here with the kids, which I found very traumatic. They were very young, about a year and a half to two years old and then almost two years older; my son is the older one, two years older. So I found driving with them very difficult. I wasn't a great driver. I didn't have any accidents. I just don't like driving. I don't like having to concentrate on driving. I want to go, "Take me to..." I'd be a great cab passenger. 4 Well, traveling with two toddlers would be monumental any time. Sometimes there were three people in the car crying, the kids and myself—she knows I'm kidding, but there were times when I really was thinking about it seriously. Had you ever been to Las Vegas before that trip? Yes. We were here with my sister and brother-in-law a few years before, thinking I would never be here again. So when we took a trip out to the west, we stopped in Vegas for a few days. I had a wonderful time. I enjoyed it here. Where did you stay on that trip? Sahara Hotel. Yes, it was because they had a card game called Pan. I don't think any hotels has it anymore. So I played Pan there. But that's where I stayed for about a week. What was the Air Force base like? I wasn't out there a lot. I went shopping at the base because it was a lot cheaper than shopping in town for most stuff. I went bowling out there once in a while, one of my great sports. So where did a young family live? A young family lives wherever—we bought a house out here. We didn't even rent a house. We rented an apartment just—no, actually I take it back. My husband bought the house without my seeing it, which was very—he did a great job. That was one of his last great jobs. I shouldn't say that. He wasn't terrible. He isn't terrible. He's just different. What neighborhood did you live in? On the east side of town on a street called Parsifal Place. Do you remember that? Bobbie Gang: No. I'm not sure I met you until you moved into Royal Crest—no, I did. No, you did. Because I remember the name of the street, but I don't remember the house, no. 5 I do because I had drapes that were...They looked great hanging, but when I went to take them down to clean them, they were all torn in the back with the lining. So was it like around where that movie theater was on Charleston? Well, not far from there. It wasn't far from there, but that's the area that it was. Huntridge. How did you develop your social world? I made some friends with neighbors. I mean, if you didn't even know anybody, I helped make the majority of the block. I was only the second Jewish family on the block; there were only two of us in the whole area. But I think people tend to find people of their religion; wherever they live they move around and find them. We joined the temple rather quickly. Is that where I met you? I think so, yes, at Sisterhood, I'm sure. This is Temple Beth Sholom? Yes. She was president of Sisterhood. I was so jealous of her. She was beautiful. She was young. She was thin. She had a handsome husband. Now you see why she's my best friend. I want to hang out with her, too. Very well-to-do. They lived nicely. I don't mean loaded rich, but more than just comfortable. It was just nice. She was so nice and thoughtful and considerate. I change that. I make it present tense, too. Thankyou. So do you remember when you first met each other? The first time? No, but I think there was a meeting at my house for some committee and it might 6 have been publicity because I think we took some art pictures for the art auction. Ah. That sounds familiar, yes. Irene was I was very active in the art auction. —a big collector of art and you can see all these— The few pieces that I have here. This is only a small portion of her collection. So when the temple did an art auction, a charity art auction— Somebody called me. The art gallery that they were going to use for the auction said that they knew somebody that lived in Vegas and they called me and I called the art gallery to make sure that it was legit or that they really were going to do the art auction. I didn't want to spend a lot of time with people that I didn't know and tout themselves. It was great. I still enjoy art. Unfortunately, I don't get to see any anymore. One of the last things I ever saw was going to a museum with you. Well, we'll do it again. But you have quite a collection. I don't have to drive. I always do. You have quite a collection in your home. Yes, Stacy [Fisher] and Steve [Eisen], my kids, have most of my collection. Why was art important to you? I liked it. It entertained me. I like looking at it. Those two pieces, as unlike as they are, are my two favorite pieces. I had seventy-five to a hundred pieces at one time. Well, tell me about the one on the right. JFK, John F. Kennedy. I got that from the artist. He signed it to us. We met him later on. Don't you have one? 7 I have one because you— Barry found the artist and you and Leonard indicated an interest in it. So Barry bought the piece—or another piece. That is George Braque, also in various and sundry museums that I've been to. I just love that. Most people know that I'm of Jewish background want to know what I'm doing with a piece with a crucifix on it. What do you tell them? I love it. It's one of my two favorite pieces that I have. You don't see most of the pieces that I have here. Stacy and Steve, my kids, pretty much furnished the room with the art in here because they knew that I liked the Indian style of art. Those are two Indian artists, American Indians. They're beautiful. As a matter of fact, both of them came to town after they sold some stuff a couple of the shops. I went and saw them and got them signed again or got them signed personally because they were just like little copies. So all the pieces that I have in here are signed by the artists. That was always something important to me to have something original.. .Having it signed by the artist gives it more value. So tell me at Nellis, what was your husband's work? What was he doing? He was a doctor at Nellis Air Force Base. He didn't do very much other than being a doctor there. His hours were very good other than the occasional appendectomy at two in the morning. Nobody got shot at Nellis. I don't think he ever—well, he may have had to dig out a bullet or two, but he didn't have to do anything of major work there. I endured. How long was he at Nellis? Two years, two full years almost to the date because they had to get rid of you or, otherwise, they 8 had to pay you for an extra month. Once you were going out, they wanted you out. So I remember signing some paperwork years ago for the Air Force that showed that I got out on such-and-such a date and I was a dependent so it didn't matter a lot. I remember the first time I saw my husband in uniform. I recognized him, but at the same time it was like, who the hell is that? It was so different for me. I wasn't used to seeing people in uniform. Then all I ever saw, at least out at the base, was people in uniform. Did you hang around with other people that were assigned to Nellis? Not very much. I hung out more with people that I lived nearby or people in the temple. I got active with the Sisterhood at the temple. Tell me about Sisterhood. What is the reason that people join it? For me it was because I met Bobbie and she was president of Sisterhood and she was nice, thoughtful, kind, considerate, any nice thing you could...But she was—you are. (Nodding to Bobbie) You helped me; even though you didn't do it on purpose, you made sure I joined because I wanted to be around you and be like you. Oh, thanks. I thought I told you that. You did, but Iforgot. That's why I asked you to interview her so she would say those nice things about me. But she was; she was thoughtful, kind, considerate. She was always helpful. I could call at almost any time and if she was home , as opposed to having a meeting once and she was out of town or away or whatever, we broke into your house; we found a way to get in to get some stuff for an art auction because you were out of town. You were away. I think you might have had a key to my house. 9 I could have had a key. Yes, yes. And there was a time when you had— Oh, when we had a fire once, I went to your house and I knocked on the door and I said, "My house is burning down. Can I leave my kids here?" And I did, Scott and Stacy. They had a wonderful time. They were little kids and they stayed with Josh and Karen, but it was too old to be friends with them. No, she wasn't rude or anything, but she was a lot older than them, and then four or five or six years was a tremendous difference in age. So tell me about the fire. It was a fire. The house smelled of smoke. People were over earlier in the day and did some work on the air-conditioning and they re-hooked it up badly. So smoke was coming into the house instead of being vented outside. It wasn't smoke-smoke. I mean, it was a smell and there was some smoke in the air, but you could hardly see anything of it. But we got out of the house and I took the kids over to Bobbie's house, gracious. "Hi; here are my kids; my house is burning; you got them." The problem is she didn't educate them and raise them. Well, our kids spent so much time at each other's houses. That we thought we had five kids, each of us, her three and my two. But there was a time; I remember one time when I had a meeting, a Sisterhood meeting, at my house, andfor some reason I was out of town and I couldn't be (there)—it must have been an emergency. Or maybe that's the time that I thought you weren't there and we had to meet there. Yes, and you had to come and entertain, serve coffee and have the meeting Oh, God, yes. —because I couldn't be there. It must have been when somebody out of town was sick or 10 something. I don't remember the details. All I remember is we couldn't find you. I was used to your not being always around because you were so busy. You were so active in things. You are active in things. But so are you. In different genres. You were this and the other thing. Then I got active in library. So that's where we sort of divided times. So Sisterhood, before we move to your library activism there, Sisterhood, what kind of fundraisers or projects did you get involved in? Art auction. That was a big fundraiser. We had one every year for several years. Yes. And I think the first year we did it was like the first year. I think it was. Yes, I'm pretty sure. Plus you bought a lot of art. God, yes. So for an art auction would you solicit the artist to donate something? No. We got an art gallery that would bring in art from Los Angeles and they brought in all sorts of art, probably at what we suggested in terms of people liked this piece of art or that piece of art, so they would bring in certain artists a little bit more of so that we'd have them available even if it wasn't the same piece. Because most of these are what they call graphic arts that means that this one, there may be twenty-five of this kind of piece with a different numbering, and this one may be a hundred and fifty, this kind of piece, and the lithographs or etchings or serigraphs, which are silkscreens, different forms of art. I had very little in the way of oil. Of course, they were too expensive. Oil is a one-of-a-kind. Graphics can be one of five or one of fifty or one of 11 two hundred. Now, when you raised this money through Sisterhood, what was your target audience? What were you going to do with that money? It was open to the temple, Sisterhood, and it was open to the public because we had [ads] in the newspaper about it. I don't know how many people from the outside actually came. Of course, the first couple of years were in the temple, in the social hall. But after that we had it in hotels because we needed the room to show the art and to seat the people because we had some nice turnouts. Very, yes. So it was one of those auctions where people would sit in an audience and they would hold up a numbered paddle? Exactly. They got a little brochure-type thing as they came in and it had a number on it, and in it, it had a description of the art that was being shown. But that was limited only to what they actually brought in and put in the brochure. They might have brought in extra pieces or had them on the truck or whatever. So sometimes there was stuff that wasn't in the brochure, but it was being offered for sale. How much money might you raise in one auction? A few thousand dollars, but just a few. It wasn't like hundreds. If we sold fifty thousand dollars' worth of art, which was a lot of art then because the pieces of art weren't hundreds of thousands of dollars, they were fifteen, a hundred, two hundred and five hundred, we got a percentage. But another thing is that at that time there weren't a lot of art galleries in Las Vegas. There was almost none. We couldn't use an art gallery in Las Vegas; there wasn't one that could do what we wanted to have them do. 12 Well, that brings up another topic of that era. Where would you shop for your personal clothes, for your kids’ clothes? Was there a Macy’s then? No. The Boulevard Mall opened up; that was the big thing and that wasn't far from where we lived. It really wasn't. You could go into lots of different kinds of stores, too, besides the department store, the two or three department stores. There was probably a Macy's there. Later on I think there was a Macy's. But there was the Broadway. That's right. More of a local... Yes, it was like a local department store. I helped fund it. I felt like I did a lot of shopping there because I had a big choice. It wasn't a little store where you go in and you have four different dresses in twelve different sizes and three different colors. The department stores had a lot of choices. Then the supermarket, the big supermarket here was Vegas Village. Oh, my goodness gracious, I almost forgot that name. Where was that located? Commercial Center. There was one at Commercial Center. Maryland Parkway and Sahara. Sahara and Oakey or something like that. That was a long time ago. I was a mere child. And if you were shopping for the Jewish holidays, were you able to find the foods that you wanted? All the supermarkets had a small (selection)...two shelves of soup. You could always get a kosher chicken or a kosher brisket or go to the butcher shop and order it ahead of time, which I 13 don't think I ever did. But there was a butcher shop that you could order stuff and they would get kosher, but they kept it in a special place so it didn't—I don't like to use this word—but it wasn't contaminated by non-kosher meats. But that was...And now you can go into any supermarket today and you can buy kosher chicken or kosher brisket or kosher this or kosher salami, and one of them used to change the slicing wheel on the machine so that it would stay truly kosher and I don't remember which store that was, which shopping center that was. Somebody told me about it and I went in and watched them do it. I mean, it wasn't like I was checking on them. I watched because I was getting something and they changed it. I don't know if they still do that today. Some of them have a kosher section today, or they did a few years ago, where you could get stuff that was truly kosher. Did you like to cook? I like to eat more than I like to cook. But, yes, I did; I liked to cook. She (Bobbie) was a good cook—she is a good cook. She cooked for her family and I would make sure that I was around when she was cooking—okay, I'm kidding. So for the typical Passover, would you host it or would you go somewhere? I hosted a couple of them or I would go somewhere. I hosted more of break-fasts. I think I had seventy-five or a hundred people at a couple of them. It was huge. We had tables in the back at one of the houses and inside and tables that it was all buffet. There was so much food. That was when you lived out in— Yes. further out in the valley. What street was that, do you remember? Pebble. It was off of Pebble? Was it Pebble? No. I can see I'm going off the freeway and I'm making a right turn on to Las 14 Vegas Boulevard and then going over five blocks. Well, it was five streets. I could be one block over and I would be lost. I have no sense of direction. She knows that. Me neither. But for a while we lived in the same neighborhood. Oh, yes. Which neighborhood was that? Royal Crest Rancheros. Right near the university, right near UNLV off of Harmon. That was a long time ago. People even liked us then. Were there a lot of Jewish people in the neighborhood? I don't think so. Not too many. We might have been it. I'm trying to think if there were others. ... We’d get lost. We got lost several times. Where did we really get lost once? We were going to a Sisterhood national convention— Was that New York? —in Upstate New York. Oh my God, yes, that's where it was. We flew in and you stayed with your folks one night; I stayed with my folks one night. And I borrowed my folks' car and I picked you up and we drove up the—Three-way, it was called. We should have gotten off in Liberty or someplace; I don't remember where. All of a sudden we saw the signs for Albany and that was like twice as far as we should have gone. And the thing was we were just— 15 We were talking, talking. —talking and we didn't shut up. And we didn't notice. We could have been in Canada before we knew it. You're laughing, but I'm serious. We really could have been in Canada if one of us didn't notice that we had gone...We're like, oh, look where we are. Yes, Albany. What would you do at national meetings? What was that like? National—I found them boring. I don't know. They talked a lot about things that were being done in various synagogues and programs for the families and the kids and also about women getting more rights in the Jewish synagogues. At that time that was a big issue. But you learned about how to get more members, how to increase your membership, how to put on programs. Yes. They taught you what to do to increase people doing things so that they were interested in becoming members and staying members, because a lot of people joined and then you turned around and the next day they weren't around. But a big part of what we did, too, was educating about the Jewish holidays. There was always a cooking class and there was a holiday class and trying to make sure that people who weren't brought up with everything and even people who were, there was always new things to learn. Then you would take this information back... We'd