Transcript of interview with Arthur "Art" Marshall by Claytee D. White, February 11, 2014

An Interview with Arthur Marshall An Oral History Conducted by Claytee White The Boyer Early Las Vegas Oral History Project Oral History Research Center at UNLV University Libraries University of Nevada Las Vegas ?The Boyer Early Las Vegas Oral History Project University of Nevada Las Vegas, 2014 Produced by: The Oral History Research Center at UNLV - University Libraries Director: Claytee D. White Project Manager: Barbara Tabach Transcriber: Kristin Hicks Editors: Maggie Lopes, Melissa Robinson Interviewers: Claytee White ii40 The recorded interview and transcript have been made possible through the generosity of Dr. Harold Boyer. The Oral History Research Center enables students and staff to work together with community members to generate this selection of first-person narratives. The participants in this project thank the university for the support given that allowed an idea the opportunity to flourish. The transcript received minimal editing that includes the elimination of fragments, false starts, and repetitions in order to enhance the reader's understanding of the material. All measures have been taken to preserve the style and language of the narrator. In several cases photographic sources accompany the individual interviews. The following interview is part of a series of interviews conducted under the auspices of the Boyer Early Las Vegas Oral History Project. Claytee D. White, Project Director Director, Oral History Research Center University Libraries University of Nevada, Las Vegas iii40 Preface Arthur Marshall was born in 1929 in Cleveland, Ohio, son of a roofing contractor and housekeeper. In 1953, Art met his wife, Jayn, who was also from Cleveland, and the couple moved to Las Vegas where she already lived with her family. Art joined his father-in-law in the family's retail clothing business. Soon after moving, Art's father-in-law retired, and he alongside his brother-in-law, Herb Rousso, took over and expanded operations as Marshall-Rousso stores. At a time when doing business in Las Vegas was based on handshakes rather than contracts, the two opened three stores on Las Vegas Boulevard, before opening their first hotel shop in the Sahara in 1964. From there, Marshall-Roussos spread across the Strip, opening stores in seven additional hotels. Art quickly became very active in the Jewish community upon arriving in Las Vegas. He served as president at Temple Beth Sholom, and sat on its board together with people like Hank Greenspun, Jerry Mack, and Jack Entratter and was instrumental in the Anti-Defamation League formation. He worked with other Jews in the city, many who owned and managed the hotels at the time, to build a strong Jewish community in Las Vegas - and to make the city a great place to live. Art is still a member of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee. With the support of Bill Boyd, Art served as the chairman of Nevada State Bank. In addition, he spent 12 years on the Nevada Gaming Commission. Art wrote a book to record the stories he has amassed over the years, those that include the likes of Frank Sinatra, Sammy Davis Jr. and Adnan Khashoggi. iv40 Table of Contents Interview with Arthur Marshall on February 11, 2014 by Claytee White in Las Vegas, Nevada Preface..........................................................................................................iv Talks about childhood in Cleveland; meeting wife and moving to Las Vegas in 1953. Discusses work in wholesale clothing business, women's retail clothing stores, working with in-laws; open stores across town, including in Sahara Hotel, the first of many hotel shop outlets. Talks about becoming active in Jewish community, serving on board at temple, alongside Jerry Mack, Hank Greenspun, Jack Entratter, Mel Moss, Harry Wallerstein............................................................1-4 Continues talking about his friends from the community, including Bill Boyd; Boyd's influence on his career, particularly at Bank of Nevada. Mentions American Israel Public Affairs Committee; moving to different homes, eventually to Las Vegas Country Club; Sheldon Adelson. Describes serving on Nevada Gaming Commission; the organization's control of gaming industry, from casino owners to dealers; changes in industry over the years...............5-11 Describes financing of Las Vegas casinos; Bank of Las Vegas; Bank of Nevada. Talks about social life when first moved to Las Vegas; fashion during that time; becoming active in the community; vacation spots. Mentions customer service standards in stores; Nevada pension system (PERS). Discusses love for art; describes various pieces in his home........................12-16 Compares Jewish community in Las Vegas to that in Cleveland; differences in local organization. Talks about Jewish community's impact on city's development; casino ownership dominance. Discusses family's current involvement with Marshall-Rousso stores; changes seen overtime in downtown area; growth of Strip. Speaks about Lou Ruvo Center; collaborations with Cleveland Clinic; vision to see Las Vegas providing world-class healthcare..................17-22 Lists some of the other individuals to interview for the Jewish oral history project. Mentions fundraisers during the Six-Day War. Talks about Frank Sinatra's effect on city; mobsters' commitment to community-building. Recounts a story told by Moe Dalitz, hosting Duke and Duchess of Windsor. Considers the future of Las Vegas; Steve Wynn's vision. Discusses local black community; the breaking of racial barriers on Strip; Anti-Semitism.............................23-30 Speaks about friend Eugene Warner; unsuccessful attempt to start Middle Eastern library at UNLV; contribution to lecture series at Anti-Defamation League. Recalls story of arms dealer Adnan Khashoggi, a meeting with Jewish doctor in Las Vegas; another of Senator Chic Hecht v40 working to get Russian Jews released from Russia. Declares that city was the center of the world; many international dealings. Tells story of Sammy Davis Jr. shopping at Marshall- Rousso at Sands Hotel. Mentions his book The Marshall Plan (2013), with additional stories..........................................................................................................................31-38 Index.......................................................................................................39-40 vi40 This is Claytee White. It is February 11, 2014, and I'm with Mr. Art Marshall in his home in Las Vegas. Could you please spell your first name for me? A-R-T-H-U-R. And Marshall is spelled the usual way? The usual way, M-A-R-S-H-A-double L. Thank you so much. Mr. Marshall, could you start by telling me just a bit about your early life, where you grew up and what that was like? I was born and raised in Cleveland, Ohio. Life was just a normal growing up. What did your parents do for a living? My father was a roofing and sheet metal contractor. Mother was a housekeeper. Did you work as a young boy? Yes, I worked. My first job was in a drugstore, and I worked in my cousin's hardware store for many years. Brothers and sisters? No brothers or sisters; I was an only child. Did you go away to school, college? I went to Kent State University for two years. How did the family come to Las Vegas? My wife was from Cleveland originally and she had moved to Las Vegas with her family in 1945. She came back to Cleveland on a visit in 1953, and we met and became engaged. That's how I happened to come out here. Which year were you born? 140 1929. What was Las Vegas like in 1953? A lot smaller. Somewhere around 50,000 people. It was lovely. Where did you live? We lived near 15th and Oakey on a street called Griffith, right below Temple Beth Sholom. That's not that far from the John S. Park community? Very close. What kind of work brought you to Las Vegas, as well? I was in the wholesale clothing business and my in-laws had opened a small store here called Sara's of Las Vegas. We helped them get the store started. We? My wife and I. I came out to join my father-in-law in the business. He retired shortly afterwards. They invited my brother-in-law, Herb Rousso, and his wife, Estelle, who was Jayn's sister, to move from Los Angeles and join us. That was the beginning of our company. Tell me about the evolution as it grew. We started out with one little store called Sara's of Las Vegas on 1404 Las Vegas Boulevard South. We then opened a second store in the Francisco Square Shopping Center, which was across from the Sahara, where The World's Largest Gift Shop is now. Then we opened a third store across from the Stardust on the corner of Convention Center Drive. Then we got lucky enough to get into the Sahara Hotel. That was the beginning of our hotel shops. We got into the Sahara Hotel in 1964. From there we went to the Sands Hotel, and from there we went into the MGM Grand. And from there we went into the Riviera, the Desert Inn, the Stardust, Caesars Palace, the Dunes and the airport, eventually. I'm giving it to you quick. 240 Yes. Tell me why women's clothing and who did the buying? At the beginning, my brother-in-law, Herb Rousso, and myself did the buying. But I had been in the wholesale clothing business before that. How did you get started in the business? In the wholesale? Yes, clothing. My wife's uncle owned a company called Bobbie Brooks. He offered me a job as a sales trainee. I became one of the stars of the company. What about women's clothes were so fascinating? If I remember correctly, these are younger women. Bobbie Brooks was younger women. They were called juniors, which meant they were sized in the odd sizes?3, 5, 7, 9, 11, 13 and 15?and they were for younger women. As Marshall-Rousso grew, you continued to cater to the younger woman? No. We became a full-fledged store. We were normal, regular. Did your wife have an active role in the business? Jayn was a very experienced interior decorator and she helped us decorate the stores, but neither she nor her sister worked in the company. They were part of the company, but they took care of the kids and helped us decorate the stores; in other words, refurbishing. Being in a place like Las Vegas, we are really away from a garment district. How did it operate? How did you get the clothing in? What was the process? We would go to Los Angeles regularly to buy, and traveling salesmen would come here all the time. Eventually, when we got into the hotels, we started to go to New York to buy as well. So we bought in both coasts. In fact, we actually went to Europe to buy a couple of times. 340 Did you go to the shows as well? We went to all the shows. Tell me more about the business end of it here in Las vegas. who were some of the people that you got to know? I want to know about people like Thomas and Mack and other people who were the business people in Las vegas. We got to know the Greenspuns really quickly, Hank and Barbara and their children. I got active in the Jewish community and before I knew it I was on the board at the temple alongside Jerry Mack, Hank Greenspun, Jack Entratter, Mel Moss and Harry Wallerstein. Most of the business people in the community, I got to know them really quickly. Billy Weinberger and I became close friends. He ran Caesars Palace. I was very active in the Jewish community. I was president of the temple, president of the federation, involved in Israel bonds. I put my time in. Tell me about the Israel bonds. I don't know what to you tell you. It was a thing. There was a branch out of Phoenix that was close to the Greenspuns; they introduced me to Israel bonds and we got involved. It was an investment to try to help the state of Israel. In fact, I was given the prime minister's medal by the State of Israel bonds. You just listed a series of businessmen. Can you start from the beginning and tell me about those men and who they were, for someone listening to this having no idea who those people are? Harry Wallerstein had a furniture store. He was active in the community. Jerry Mack was Bank of Las Vegas. Hank Greenspun was the Las Vegas Sun. Mel Moss was a contractor and a builder. I think he built the Riviera Hotel if I'm not mistaken. Moe Dalitz ran the Desert Inn. Parry Thomas was the Bank of Las Vegas. Who else did I mention? 440 Entratter. Jack Entratter was president of the Sands Hotel. We became very good friends. Tell me about any interactions with Greenspun because he really had a great tie with Israel, got into some problems at one time. Were you a part of any of that? That was before my time. We became very close with the Greenspuns. I think I was introduced to all the national, world Jewish organizations through Hank and Barbara. I became active in all those issues with them. I was a member of AIPAC for a while. I still belong to AIPAC. Tell me what that is. AIPAC is the American Israel Public Affairs Committee. And what does it do? It lobbies Washington for the state of Israel. Can you tell me some of the issues that you have lobbied for? I don't think there's any particular issue. You lobby for the continued support and a good relationship with the state of Israel. We lobby to try to get the Russian Jews out of Russia. I became very friendly with Chic Hecht. He became a United States Senator and one of my very best friends. What kind of a businessman was he? Chic had a little dress shop downtown and was also a member of the board of directors of Nevada State Bank. It was through Chic Hecht that I became a director of Nevada State Bank. One of my earliest friends in town was Bill Boyd. Tell me about Mr. Boyd. Mr. Boyd is probably one of the best people in the world. We had heard that the store at the Sahara Hotel was available, the dress shop. We didn't know anybody there. Milton Prell ran the 540 hotel. Bill Boyd lived across the street from us when we lived on Griffith. I went over and knocked on his door and said, "Could you get me an appointment with your dad's associates?" His father had a piece of the hotel. He said, "Of course," and he set up an appointment. Herb Rousso, Bill Boyd and I went to meet with Milton Prell. Obviously, we think that Hank Greenspun put in a good word because when we got there, Prell said, "I know all about you guys, but I don't know if you know enough about a hotel shop." Remember, we had the street stores. I don't know where it came from but I said, "Mr. Prell, the president of every major department store in the United States starts out in a bargain basement, and when this was Club Bingo I wonder if they thought Milton Prell could run Club Bingo?" He said, "Thank you." He ushered us out. He said to Bill, "I like what the kid said; I'm going to give him the store." That was the beginning of my career and Bill Boyd was responsible for that. That's great. What was the difference in running an independent building, store, and a casino store? You just fill it with a higher level of merchandise. Did you find that there was a difference? There was definitely better merchandise. We got more into the fashion business. That's interesting. Bill Boyd has had a lot to do with my career. He's the one who made me chairman of the Bank of Nevada. How did he make you chair? He was the major shareholder. He had the votes. It's easy; when you have the votes, you have the say-so. Wow. So being the chair of the Bank of Nevada meant that you became, then, close with?is 640 it Thomas or Mack? No. Bank of Nevada had nothing to do with Thomas or Mack. Which bank did they have? They had Bank of Las Vegas. Bank of Las Vegas, okay. We became close to them when we got the dress shop at the Sands Hotel and we were raising the financing for the construction of the store through Valley Bank. I became close to Jerry Mack in the Jewish community. He and I were involved in federation together. He eventually became our neighbor. We lived in the Las Vegas Country Club together. When did you leave Griffith to move into the country club? We left Griffith in 1963 or 1964 and moved to a street off 15th called Maria Elena Drive. We probably left there in 1985 and built a home in the Las Vegas Country Club, two or three doors away from Jerry Mack. Was Entratter in the country club at that time? No, Entratter never lived there. He always lived in the Sands Hotel. But (indiscernible) lived in the country club. Eventually Sheldon Adelson bought the house next door to me. He's one of my dearest friends. Wonderful. Thanks for the introduction for the library. You're welcome. Great. Why did you think that was good for the library to meet him? Because Sheldon is a shaker and a mover that makes the world change. He's a remarkable man, a remarkable man, generous, great. You can't have a better friend. What do you think of as your major accomplishment in Las Vegas? 740 Well, I spent 12 years on the Nevada Gaming Commission. I was appointed by Governor Bob Miller, reappointed twice by Kenny Guinn and actually offered the fourth term by Governor Gibbons. But by that time Mrs. Marshall had become ill, and I had decided to retire from the bank and devote my time to her. Tell me about the gaming commission. Tell me how it works and what it does. The gaming commission controls and approves and licenses everybody who has anything to do with the gaming industry, whether it's an employee, a dealer, an owner, a manufacturer. It's the life and breath of the gaming industry. when you say dealer, what do you mean? A dealer is a person who deals and works in the hotel. Right. So what does? They're all under the control of the gaming industry. In other words, they all need permission. They have to have a work card. Okay, I see. It's the work card. To get a work card, they're all subject to gaming commission control. If they misbehave, if they do something in their home life that's wrong, they can lose their work card and unable to work in the gaming industry. You have that much control over a dealer. They have control over everything. Give me an example over the years that you can talk about. That's the example. Someone who's a dealer that works in the hotel and gets into some incident with narcotics or they shoplift or they get into some kind of a dispute and they get arrested, they can lose their work card. They can lose their permit to work. Didn't you know that? 840 No. Of course. I didn't know that it was to that level. I thought you were only at that top level. Everything that has anything to do with gaming. Walk me through the?if I am going to buy a new hotel here in Las Vegas, walk me through the procedure. What would I have to do? The first thing you have to do would be to hire a very good gaming lawyer and fill out applications, giving your total history, all your sources of income; everything you're done probably since you were a small child; probably every check you've ever written, look at all your records; how you pay your income tax, whether you pay your income tax appropriately. They'll even evaluate your income tax returns to see that you paid them correctly. They look at your arrest history if you have an arrest history. They look at everything you've done, who you've associated with. In other words, whether you associate with people who are of bad worth. so that's me as an individual. Individual to get a license to own a hotel. If I'm a corporation, what happens? Then your key employees have to be examined. In other words, your board of directors, your key employees, everybody, for example, at Boyd Gaming. Mr. Boyd, all of his major partners and all of the directors of the board of directors have to be approved, licensed. If a new person joins the board of directors? They have to be licensed. Wow. They have to have a complete investigation. 940 And the investigation is paid for by me as the individual or the corporation? Generally by the corporation. But if you're an independent operator and you're going to open your own hotel, you pay for it yourself. This investigation cost up to $300,000 or more. Wow. Amazing. So what kinds of changes did you see in the gaming industry from that beginning of your appointment to the time when you decided to retire? One of the first changes that happened during my tenure was the work permit situation. When I got on the gaming commission, they had a five-year rule. In other words, you had a one-year period of time in which you could reapply for your card if you lost it for whatever reason. If you were not granted the card in that one-year period, you had to wait five years before you could reapply. I thought that was too severe. So I finally got it changed to where it could be five years or less, so we could judge each individual case. I believed very much in second chances. I kind of initiated that. There's a Gaming Control Board consisting of three full-time members. They first opine and make a judgment of yes or no on every issue. From there it goes to the commission and the commission sits over the control board. So the control board, if they vote yes, the commission can vote no by majority. If the control board votes no, the commission has to vote unanimously to overrule it. That's how that works. How many people are on the commission? Five. Give me examples of other kinds of changes you've seen over the years. The corporate change; we went from individual owners to corporate. The big investment company changes. In other words, we were able to change the rules that would allow us to only deal with major shareholders and their major operators. In other words, we couldn't possibly look at every 1040 stockholder at MGM. We also went through the changes where MGM acquired Mirage and Mandalay. I was part of that. We also made a change where we went into private salon gaming so we could take care of the high rollers, what they call whales. Explain to me about a private salon. What is that like and the purpose? The purpose of the private salon is to allow people to gamble privately. But we had to put in supervision with cameras and equipment so we could monitor everything and they had to get permission to open a salon. The rules have been changed since I've left. There were restrictions as to the minimum amount of gaming, of the wagers. There was a minimum wager. So the private salon would not just be open for just anyone because it's an expensive thing for the hotel to open, but it's where a lot of the baccarat play goes. What is the minimum? I think it's now $500. At one point they wanted a minimum bankroll, I think, of somewhere around $300,000, but I don't remember that clearly. I'm not clear on that anymore. Some of that's changed. Tell me what happened?we've been watching Caesars change?the Barbary Coast, we've seen that go to Bill's Gambling Hall. Then we saw something happen a few months ago. Did the gaming commission have anything to do with what happened with that property? No. No say-so whatsoever? No, not that I know of. But now that it is going to continue, it's going to become a hotel now under a different name, 1140 The Cromwell, you will license that as parts of Caesars so Caesars doesn't have to do anything under the commission? I'm not quite sure how that will work. When they open a new facility, we will have to license the key employees. In other words, whoever the president of the hotel is. But all the key employees will have to be licensed. But I would think they're licensed?if I remember correctly, it will go under Caesars's license, the license of the corporation. I want to learn a bit more about the banking system. At one time casinos had to get private loans to build a property because banks wouldn't finance them. So I want to know more about banks, like the Bank of Nevada and the Bank of Las Vegas, turned that around and decided to start financing. It takes major banks to finance casinos. A Bank of Nevada does not finance casinos. As big as we are that just isn't where we go. It's probably Bank of America that does it and Wells Fargo, Deutsche Bank and some of the big New York and worldwide banks. They have the assets and they have the funds. Didn't the Bank of Las Vegas, though, help to put together some of those? Bank of Las Vegas was very active in the gaming industry here. Parry Thomas and Jerry Mack were very much involved in helping arrange financing for the Dunes and the Riviera, and some of the other hotels. They probably helped most of the hotels get started, but it became larger than what they could supply. Then, of course, they sold Bank of Las Vegas to the Bank of America. Bank of Las Vegas became Valley Bank and then it went to Bank of America. Why doesn't Bank of Nevada engage in financing the gaming industry? It was larger than our capacity. Bank of Nevada started out as Bank West of Nevada; it was formed by Bill Boyd, myself, Don Snyder, Marianne Boyd and a handful of people. We started 1240 with eight million dollars. Today we're almost a ten-billion-dollar company. Big, ten billion. Yes. I'm listening. I'm impressed by that. So tell me about? Cute little anecdote. My granddaughter was probably about six or seven years old and we were driving from dinner one night. She was in the car with her mother, my wife and I, and we drove past the bank. I said, "Isn't it wonderful? We're only three years old and we've gone from 8 million to 300 million. We're a 300 million-dollar bank in three years." And this little kid says, "Is that how much it holds or is that how much it's worth?" That's great. So tell me about some of the fun things that you did when you and your wife first got here. What did you do for entertainment? We played tennis and we socialized. But we had some more kids at that point, so we were mother and father. We played nursery school. That's what we did when we first got here. We socialized. I became active in the community very early. I felt being active in the community was a good way to introduce myself to the community and it worked. It was to my benefit because eventually when I went to go to see a hotel owner about if a shop was available, it was somebody that I had worked with in one sense or another in the charity community. My reputation preceded us as the fact that we were very careful with our pricing. I remember one day at the Sands Hotel, Carl Cohen, who ran the casino, said to me, "I don't want anybody being overcharged. I don't want somebody coming in here from Los Angeles and losing money in the casino and then being overcharged for a blouse or a bathing suit or a dress." I said, "Our prices will be exactly the same as Los Angeles." And we kept it that way. That was one of the reasons we thrived so quickly because the hotels liked that we did that. The other thing is the customer was always right. If somebody came in and bought a pair of shoes or a dress and wore it to the dinner show and came back the next day and said this doesn't 1340 work, it doesn't fit, they hurt, we took it back. They never had to go upstairs to the hotel desk. Over the years it never amounted to anything, really. Was the pricing the same in the hotel shops as they were in your private locations? Exactly. In other words, we were competitive with Los Angeles. In both locations? Everywhere. And that was one of our great secrets because the hotels appreciated that we weren't trying to gouge the customer. They would bend over backwards in the old days to make sure somebody had three-minute eggs in three minutes, and they certainly didn't want them going in and buying a bathing suit for ten dollars more than it would cost in Los Angeles. We were a branded name, a label name. Did your wife wear the clothes in the shops? Yes, she did. When you first came here, did your wife dress to go out to the casinos if you were going out to dinner? Oh, yes. We always dressed. So what did it look like in the Sands and the Dunes when you would go out to dinner or to a show? It was wonderful. People were well dressed. Women wore mink stoles if they had them. They wore furs, depending on the time of the year, of course. Men always wore a tie. You never saw jeans or things like that. You saw suits. You'd see sport jackets. You didn't see a lot of long dresses, but women wore dresses. You never saw many slacks, women's pants. The town dressed very nicely in those days. But it's changed. That's all gone. When it came to getting away from town, did you ever go to Mount Charleston, to 1440 recreational areas in Utah or other places? We went to Mount Charleston. We went to Red Rock often. We went up to?where is that little ski place up north, just up in Utah? BARBARA: Brian Head? Brian Head. We'd visit. We'd take the car and drive up there. About 26 years ago we bought a condo in Coronado, California. So it's summer there. We would travel to Europe every summer, for the month of June. We brought a lot of antiques in and put an antique department in the store. We trimmed our dress shops with antiques. Oh. To give them flavor. I was also on the board of the Public Employees Retirement System (PERS). Governor List put me on that board. Tell me what that is. That's the PERS, the pension system for the state of Nevada. You're probably a PERS member. No, I'm not PERS, but I know a lot of people who are part of that, probably half of the campus. I'm sure. I was on the board of PERS for several years. When Richard Bryan took over, Chic Hecht went to the senate and I took over his responsibilities at Bank of Nevada on that board of director's job. You were just talking about antiques in your stores. Do I see some of the artwork here, as well? Yes, you do. These wooden niches?we have five of them in here?came from Hearst Castle. So who is the art lover, you or your wife? 1540 We both were. She's been gone about four and a half years. We both were. We collected Russian art. What about the horses? I see a lot of horses. The horses are all done by a Russian artist except that one over there. That one over there is the French retreating from Moscow. You can see the wind blowing through his coat. That's a bronze. Wonderful. The bronzes behind you, the greater percentage of them, the ones on both sides, not in the center, were done by Paul Troubetzkoy, who was a Russian prince. Even though we happened to buy them on a quirk, we collected Russian. Because he was a Russian prince and a Russian sculptor, his bronzes were sold in the Russian auctions at New York. So even though they were cowboys and Indians, they all came by a Russian artist. We never collected cowboy art. Eventually we did get into some western art. This is Pavlova, the ballet dancer. That's beautiful. I love that and that one. Larry Christianson. Beautiful. That's Tolstoy, the best of Tolstoy, Tolstoy on horseback. The two cowboys are in a book called Great Bronzes of the American West. On the other side of the fireplace there are some [Native Americans] by Troubetzkoy and above there there's a very famous bronze, Alexander, Czar Alexander the Second. I'll have to look at that when I get up. You'll have to look at that. It's a great bronze. Tell me where your family is from originally. My father came from Divinsk, Latvia, a little town on the Russian border. My mother came from 1640 the Ukraine, in the center of Russia. They met in Cleveland. They immigrated in the early 1920s. So during World War I? They were in Russia. They left after the revolution. Amazing. As you probably know, the university including the Oral History Research Center and other entities on campus, we're getting ready to do a look at the Jewish experience in Las Vegas. And Barbara, as you probably have heard, Barbara has been married to a Jewish person for? Thirty-something years. I never converted, but we raised our children in the Jewish faith. Good. Yes. I contributed. So Barbara is going