Transcript of interview with Arne Rosencrantz by Barbara Tabach, February 18, 2015

AN INTERVIEW WITH ARNE ROSENCRANTZ An Oral History Conducted by Barbara Tabach Southern Nevada Jewish Heritage Project Oral History Research Center at UNLV University Libraries University of Nevada Las Vegas ii ?Southern Nevada Jewish Community Digital Heritage Project University of Nevada Las Vegas, 2014 Produced by: The Oral History Research Center at UNLV ? University Libraries Director: Claytee D. White Project Manager: Barbara Tabach Transcriber: Kristin Hicks Interviewers: Barbara Tabach, Claytee D. White Editors and Project Assistants: Maggie Lopes, Amanda Hammar iii The recorded interview and transcript have been made possible through the generosity of a Library Services and Technology Act (LSTA) Grant. The Oral History Research Center enables students and staff to work together with community members to generate this selection of first-person narratives. The participants in this project thank University of Nevada Las Vegas for the support given that allowed an idea the opportunity to flourish. The transcript received minimal editing that includes the elimination of fragments, false starts, and repetitions in order to enhance the reader?s understanding of the material. All measures have been taken to preserve the style and language of the narrator. In several cases photographic sources accompany the individual interviews with permission of the narrator. The following interview is part of a series of interviews conducted under the auspices of the Southern Nevada Jewish Heritage Project. Claytee D. White Director, Oral History Research Center University Libraries University of Nevada Las Vegas iv PREFACE Arne Rosencrantz is the former president and owner of Garrett's Furniture in Las Vegas, Nevada. Rosencrantz was born on September 27, 1947 in Longview, Washington. He moved to Las Vegas in 1952 and attended Nevada Southern University, now known as the University of Nevada, Las Vegas (UNLV). In 1967, Rosencrantz began working at Garrett's Furniture, and in 1979, he purchased the company and became its president. He was president of the Jewish Federation of Las Vegas from 1987 to 1988, and also served as a campaign chairman for the Federation and chairman of its Young Leadership Program. In this interview, Rosencrantz shares his grandparents and father?s immigration story, which took them from Russian to Portland, Oregon. He also talks about moving to Las Vegas, his childhood experiences, especially within the Jewish community, and reflects on the growth of his family?s furniture business in the city. Rosencrantz has been highly involved in the Jewish community over the decades, including the Young Leadership Program, United Jewish Appeal, Temple Beth Sholom, and the Jewish Federation. He is married to Lynn Rosencrantz and has two children, Marcus and Amy. v TABLE OF CONTENTS Interview with Arne Rosencrantz On February 18, 2015 by Barbara Tabach in Las Vegas, Nevada Preface?????????????????????????????????..?..iv Talks about family ancestry; grandparents and father?s immigration to United States and settling into life in Portland, Oregon, where grandparent owned a tavern; father?s musical talent; playing violin; traveling the world as orchestra leader ? until met his mother. Discusses parents moving him and sister to Las Vegas, working as musician at Sahara Hotel and Casino, before opening furniture business. Mentions other Portlanders that migrated to Las Vegas???????...1-6 Describes growing up in John S. Park area; attending Sunday school; parents? involvement in Jewish community and with Temple Beth Sholom; challenge to remain kosher with limited local options. Reflects upon Jewish community leaders in 1950s; the number of unaffiliated Jews, despite population growth. Discusses details of father starting furniture store, Hollywood Furniture, with silent partner; opening location in Henderson; selling businesses?????7-13 Discusses father getting back into furniture business, first working for Sheppard?s Furniture, then starting own business, Garrett?s Furniture, with designer George Garrett. Talks about working in the store, from cleaning to office work to eventual co-ownership; growth of business over the decades, with loyal customer base. Shares about wife, Lynn; her professional background as educator for deaf children and later as family counselor, author and artist???????..14-17 Talks about the three Garrett?s Furniture locations; being a bar mitzvah. Gives credit to wife, Lynn, for involvement in Jewish community as adult, including participating in the Jewish Federation?s Young Leadership program; serving on Temple Beth Sholom board; serving on National Young Leadership Cabinet; United Jewish Appeal. Notes the importance of vising Israel in solidifying his Jewish identity. Shares memories of mentor Jerry Countess?..???....18-23 Shares about serving on medical board, appointed by Governor Bob Miller; positive experience growing up in Las Vegas, from schools to friendships to Jewish community. Talks about son and daughter, and their Jewish education with Temple Beth Sholom, Hebrew Academy; grandchildren. Mentions influential local Jewish leaders, including Art Lurie, Danny Goldfarb, Art and Jane Marshall??????????????????????????????.??...24-27 vi Reflections on anti-Semitism in Las Vegas and while serving in National Guard. Mentions contributions of Lloyd and Edythe Katz on local Jewish community. More about children?s youth activities, including USY, summer Jewish camp in California, Camp Alonium. Talks about life after Garrett?s Furniture and getting into real estate?????????????.???28-30 Index........................................................................................................................................31-32 1 1 Today is February 18, 2015. We're sitting in my office. I'm Barbara Tabach and I'm sitting with Arne Rosencrantz. Arne, would you spell your name for us, please? A-R-N-E. R-O-S-E-N-C-R-A-N-T-Z. Great. Where I like to start with this story, for this project, is how far back in your genealogy can you go? Where are your ancestors from? Ancestors from both sides of my parents...my mother's father was from Kiev, Russia; and my grandparents on my father's side were from Odessa, Russia. My father came to America in 1904. He was the first son?or first child, I will say, that survived; my grandmother and grandfather had four other children prior to my father and they passed away at young ages. When my father was four years old, they came over. Actually, my grandfather came first, moved to Portland, Oregon, and my grandmother and father came about a year later, a very difficult trip I gathered from my grandmother when she was alive. What did she tell you about that trip? Well, there's the trip on the boat and not very nice and a long time and the food wasn't adequate and good. The conditions of the boat were not sanitary, as nice as they should have been. Then they were very, very poor. It was certainly a big move for both sides of the family. How did they choose Portland, do you know? On my father's side, my grandfather had a relative in Portland, so that's why he came. And his name was not Rosencrantz, but their name in Russia was (Pesact) and they changed their name to Rosencrantz?it was a cousin, I think, [that] changed his name to Rosencrantz; thought that would sound more American than Pesact. So when my grandfather came he wanted to be with his family, so he changed his name to Rosencrantz. 2 That's interesting. It is. Is Rosencrantz a Russian name? I believe it's a German name. You know what? I'm not recalling what it means, but it does mean something about flowers, I think. That's very interesting. What did they do in Portland? My grandfather on my father's side was a cantor at a synagogue for almost thirty years, a conservative Jew. Well, he was orthodox. He was raised orthodox, but he was at a conservative shul in Portland, which still exists. My grandfather on my mother's side was a tailor and he got a job at a department store. But at a fairly early age he started having eye problems; he had glaucoma and went blind. Not too good to be a tailor if you're blind. No. But my grandmother was very smart, a very clever woman, and she opened up a tavern and a restaurant where my grandfather could take care?it was a beer tavern. They had beer taverns in those days in Oregon. They had food and my grandfather took care of the beer. So my grandfather learned basically a new way of life and my grandmother sort of took care of the food part of it and they were very successful. There are some really nice articles about my grandfather. He really, at later days, ran the tavern by himself. He knew where each beer was. The only thing that he really ever had problems with was determining whether it was a dollar or five dollars or a ten-dollar bill that they gave him. He had friends there at the bar and they would tell him what it was. But he knew where the beers were. He knew from the pop was, where the different brands were. It was really an amazing story. He was a very nice gentleman. He lived to be almost 3 ninety, I think. He lived blind for fifty some odd years. Isn't that amazing? Yes, it is. What was the name of his establishments? It was York's Tavern?York's Place. I have pictures and I have some nice stories of our grandfather in our family archives. How does all of that family heritage trickle down into the next generation? My grandfather believed in education on my father's side. My father went to school and did very well in school. He started playing the violin at a very young age, maybe six or seven years old, and violin was really his passion, but my grandfather wanted him to go to school. So my dad actually got?born in 1904?he got through the second year of college, which was pretty amazing in those days. But the family needed my money and my dad was working part-time playing his violin and left school and became a professional musician. In the meantime, my grandmother and grandfather had four more children, all survived, three more brothers and a sister. They all stayed in the Northwest and came out and followed my father here to Las Vegas when he moved here in the early '50s. So what kind of professional violin playing? Was it with an orchestra? He was concert-trained violinist, but he made a living by playing...he played cruise ships. He played mostly in the Northwest. But he did cruises. I have pictures of him in Bora Bora and Hawaii, Tahiti and Cuba. He was able to travel quite well. He actually had a group and he was the orchestra leader. He had like...most pictures I see about seven or eight people in the group with him as the orchestra leader. He developed quite a reputation and that's what he did. He was a musician until he was almost forty years old when he met my mother. He was single and wanted 4 to get married, but he waited until he was forty. How did they meet? He was from Portland. My mother was from Portland. I think my mother was working in a department store in Portland and she met him and he was a musician. And her brother was a musician. My mother had a brother named Harry York and he was a musician. He was a piano player and he was out every night. My mother said, ?I do not want a marriage??to herself, I think, said, ?I'm not going to marry a musician and have him be gone all the time.? She said, ?I would like to have a family.? So I think after a while...he went back to San Francisco. The families knew each other. They didn't get serious until my dad decided he...was not experiencing the kind of success as soon as his hair turned gray. In the music business they wanted younger people, and so he wasn't getting called. He was a union musician. If he was waiting for a job, they would take younger people. He decided to come back to Oregon and get into retail and that's what he did. That's when he joined with my mother and became a couple and got married. And got married and had kids and all of that. Right. Got married, had kids. We lived in Portland. He lived in Portland with my mother and I have a sister who was born in Portland. Then they moved to?he was in the jewelry business in Portland, Oregon. It was very small and not enough money. So he needed to move. He moved about 90 miles north of Portland?called Longview, Washington; that's where I was born?and he went into the furniture business, a small store. He stayed in that business for a couple of years. I was born and we lived in Longview for about two more years and moved back to Portland, mainly because he had two children and we were in a small city in the state of Washington with not a big enough Jewish community to have a temple and he wanted his kids to have a Jewish education. So he moved back to Portland and he went back into the jewelry 5 business with his brother, also a very small store, and was not doing well enough to really just stay there. At the time, the Sahara Hotel, here in Las Vegas, was being built. That was being built by predominately guys from Portland, businessmen and people who had some experience in gaming. They said, ?George, if you're looking for a place to come and work, find a job or find a place to have a business,? he said, ?Las Vegas is the place.? So my dad came out and spent six months here working here at the Sahara Hotel when it opened as a musician. He was a violinist. Found himself a location to put a retail store and built a furniture store. The building was there, but he put furniture in it. He brought my mother, my sister and myself to Las Vegas with the intent of maybe only staying a few years. Make enough money and go back to his family where he had his brothers and sisters and parents were?his father wasn't living, but his mother was living. Go back to Portland where the family was. But that didn't happen. They were very happy here in Las Vegas and here we are. Wow. So there's a lot of questions in all of that. That's a great scenario. Why the furniture business? Explain that a little bit. Why did he end up on that? He had a cousin in Longview who had a very successful furniture store. I think he helped?his name was Sy Goldberg?and he helped Sy in the furniture store and Sy helped him start the little furniture store that he had in Longview. I think it was retail and he liked it. I would have preferred he be in the jewelry business, but he liked furniture and so that was just his choice. I don't think there were any familial reasons why he was doing that. It's just he felt it was a good business. He liked it and that's what he decided to do. And then at the...Sahara, you said? 6 Yes. Okay. Who were the Portland people? There was a gentleman named Al Winters, a gentleman named Milton Prell. Let's see if I can remember the names. Those are the two predominate names. Yes, I've heard the name Milton Prell. Barney Winters was there. Herman Cosell. All people from Portland. It was very interesting. When I say ?all,? there were a lot of people from Portland. They were investors in this hotel. It was a really nice hotel. I have wonderful memories of the Sahara. In fact, I need to go over and see the SLS now that it's open again. A lot of the people in the community spent Sundays at the Sahara Hotel around the pool, especially in the summertime, because it was a beautiful pool and they welcomed locals. Very nice. It was nice. How old were you when you moved here? I think we moved here when I was four or five years old. So you probably don't have much memory of moving? My main memory of moving is we came here in the summertime, my sister and I separated by a dog in the middle in the backseat and my parents in the front seat. We drove in July and there was a huge electrical storm and I said, ?This is terrific.? I mean it was one of those storms where the lightning and thunder and it was really beautiful driving through the desert. So that is my memory of moving here. I do remember that. And then I have lots of fairly good memories of where we lived for a year. My father rented a home. Where was that? 7 That was on West Charleston on Barnard Street, not really very far, not even to Decatur, but it was pretty far out in those days, out west. We lived there for a year. Then my father bought a home in...I don't know the area?well, the John S. Park area you would call it today. I don't think it was called that, but John S. Park. We lived in a very nice house for the time, probably 1954, this home on Beverly Way. Wow. And I know we were talking about how in your previous interview that was part of the John S. Park project there weren't a lot of Jewish people in the neighborhood. Well, there were a lot of people if you probably consider what the whole John S. Park area was and going down to where they built the temple there were quite a few Jewish people. But in my couple of blocks that I lived in there weren't too many Jewish children. Most of the community, the large part of the community of that area was LDS, Mormons. I had great relationships with my Mormon friends. It was a wonderful neighborhood to live in. I enjoyed it. Yes, I was going to say most people seem to have really warm memories about growing up in that area. When did you realize that you were Jewish? Oh, at a very young age. I started Sunday school at five or six years old, as soon as we got to Las Vegas, I remember. And one of the interesting things about it is we had a dog. As I said, we brought the dog with us from Portland. And Sunday mornings he got to go to Sunday school with us, to take us. My parents would take my sister and I to Sunday school. And the dog would always be ready right at the door because she knew she was going to get a ride to Sunday school. So that memory...the dog had the memory and I have the memory, too. I remember going to Sunday school and that was at the little synagogue they had on Stewart and Fremont Street, or real close to Fremont Street. It was called the Jewish Community Center at the time. Who was your Sunday school teacher, do you remember that? That's a tough question. 8 Well, I remember that I had several. But the one I do remember was Mrs. Smith. Mrs. Smith was a convert. She was married?and I can't think of his name. A very nice man, very nice woman. And they had a son that they had adopted; his name was Jacob. And I'm still friends with Jacob. He went all through Sunday school with me and junior high and high school and is an attorney now living in the Bay Area. But Jacob's mother was a convert and she taught Sunday school and Hebrew school. Hebrew school was pretty small, but I remember she taught both. And I remember being in school and you're going to ask me names and I probably can't give you a bunch of names of the kids that I was in Sunday school and Hebrew school with. But it was like seven or eight, nine kids. They did it by grades, if I remember right. Good feelings. I always enjoyed going to Sunday school. The Hebrew school might have been a different issue when we were old enough to go to Hebrew school. But Sunday school was great and we went to services. My dad took a very active role at the temple. I enjoyed my Jewish upbringing here in Las Vegas very much. So you said your dad took an active role? Yes. Your dad, his name is George. George. My dad was on the board. My mother was on the Sisterhood board. It was a small Jewish community back in the '50s. We did have a rabbi and my recollection is we always had a cantor, too. So it's interesting that even though we were very small we did have both those clergy. Who was the rabbi you remember? I remember Rabbi Cohen. I think he was the first rabbi that I remember. And then we have a long list of rabbis since. But Rabbi Cohen was the first rabbi I remember. We had a cantor named Kinnory, who was a very good friend of my father. My dad was the choir director for a while 9 along with Maury King who was a choir director. All volunteer people, obviously. My mother was very active on the Sisterhood, as I said. So we had a nice Jewish upbringing. All my parents' friends revolved around the synagogue and it did for the Jewish community in general here. All the people who we can think of who were living in Las Vegas, the Jewish Community Center was the social thing in Las Vegas. There was no country clubs. There wasn't things like that in the early '50s. Yes, you can keep it in time perspective by what was available. So over the years, the synagogue relocated and grew. Well, no, let me back up first. So were you observant as far as dietary rules and all that because you mentioned that? No, we were not observant. Interesting because my father was raised in an orthodox family, but my mother was not, and he became much more liberal. So we were not. It seems like there's that wave of liberalism that works in. Right. My father-in-law was that same way. We watched him go from very kosher to very not kosher. I assume my father over the years once he left home it was hard for him to stay kosher. But I know my grandparents' home was kosher on my father's side. Because talk about even trying to find kosher foods or a good butcher here was always challenging in the early days. Right. There was a kosher butcher back here, though, in the early '50s. I remember he was a Hungarian immigrant and he had a kosher butcher store. I remember my mother could get?I know this sounds terrible?chicken feet for an Old Russian recipe that her mother used to make. 10 So she was able to get those from the kosher butcher. Yes, that does not sound yummy. [Laughing] It's terrible. Our palettes change, too. Yes. Well, I actually liked it when I was a child. I don't think I would like it today, but I did like it then. That's good. So with Temple Beth Sholom we had the roundtable. Did we cover the history of the synagogue well? You've really been there a very long time. Yes, I'm probably one of the ten or fifteen oldest?not of age maybe, but for years of longevity being at the synagogue. I've been there a long time. I remember when they decided they would build a new synagogue. I can actually remember that. The first year I think I was bar mitzvahed in Temple Beth Sholom on Oakey. I remember my dad having to make a pledge. And I think they got a lot of the board and a lot of members of the Jewish community to make a pledge to be able to finance the synagogue that they would have the money and the loan be guaranteed by the Jewish community. I do remember that. And I remember even though we had the synagogue and were fund raising for it, my dad had friends who were very busy working with bonds, at the time Israeli bonds. And they were also working on what today we call the UJA [United Jewish Appeal] campaign or the...there was a lot going on in the Jewish community even in the '50s. It was small, but a lot going on. When you think about it, who were the leaders at that time? Who would be on that list? We had Harry and Kay Wallerstein. I don't know if you've heard that name yet or not. But Harry was also a furniture retailer and he was partners with Max Goot in a furniture store. Both Harry and Max were very hard workers for the Jewish community. Harry was president of the 11 synagogue in years. They had a gentleman who just passed away, Stan Irwin, who was president. I remember him being there a lot. Jack Entratter from the Sands Hotel. In a little later years, Art Marshall, who I'm sure you've interviewed, a great guy, very active and his family was very active. Danny Goldfarb. His wife is still alive and living here in Las Vegas. There just was numerous people. When I think of the names of the older people where were here, they were involved with synagogue. They were involved with Temple Beth Sholom. That's the only synagogue we had. Until it all changed, right? Well, it hasn't changed for a long time, though. I mean I think... I don't remember what year Ner Tamid?it just had an anniversary. It just had its fortieth anniversary. It was the fortieth anniversary. They were the first offshoot of Temple Beth Sholom. About that time they had an Orthodox Shul to start, a really small Shul. So it was forty years before somebody left and decided; that's a long time. That is a very long time. And it wasn't like the Jewish population was not growing. No, it was growing. Of course, in Las Vegas one of the things that I see, have seen clearly for a long time, is that there are a lot of?unidentified and unaffiliated Jews, more unaffiliated than unidentified who don't belong to a synagogue or don't participate in the Jewish community. Why do you think that is? I don't know. I used to think when I was very active and I at one time was president of the Federation, I thought that people came here on a snowbird or retired-type basis and were very busy from whatever community they came from. Maybe they were very active. I just couldn't imagine it being any different that they wouldn't have been involved in New York or Brooklyn or wherever they lived in cities around the country. Then they come to Las Vegas and they just didn't want to 12 participate anymore. They just retired and they wanted to take a break. But with the onset of all the new synagogues, now we're seeing it?although we still have a lot of Jews that are unaffiliated, I think that there's more choices for people. So the fact that Temple Beth Sholom isn't the only synagogue, it's still a significant one and an important one, but it's also nice that we have these new places and people can go to other places. So let's go back to the retail business for a little bit and then we'll get back into some other...Who were the competitors? And you mentioned one? Max, Max Goot. You're not caring if they're just Jewish or not, right, just old? No, no. I'm just trying to get a sense of what the furniture retail industry was like in Las Vegas. How did you come up with the name Garrett's Furniture; that kind of thing? Tell me the background of that. Okay, the background of that was my father had a store that he started. It's approximately in the location of where the Stratosphere is now, hotel. He had that and he named it Hollywood Furniture. He had a partner from Portland, Oregon, sort of was a silent partner. They were really good friends. And the silent partner came to Las Vegas and bought the gift shop at the El Rancho Hotel where I also spent a lot of time because he owned the gift shop and he had a son and we were at the pool at the El Rancho Hotel a lot in the summertime. He didn't know anything about the furniture business and he sold the gift shop and wanted to become active in the furniture business that my dad and him had started. They also had built a store in Henderson, Nevada, which was a true suburb in those days because it wasn't attached by a community. Basically, Henderson was a suburb. It was a little industrial community, mostly blue-collar workers. So they started a smaller furniture store in downtown Henderson. In the meantime, Bob Levoff, my dad's partner, decided that since he sold his gift shop, he wanted to do something in the furniture 13 business. So my father said, ?Well, what do you want to do, Bob? You really would not be good selling because your personality doesn't really work for that.? He said, ?I don't know.? So dad said, ?Well, why don't you take care of the warehouse and the deliveries?? They were younger then at that time, in their forties. I think that's what Bob did. But after about six months or so, Bob's wife didn't like that he was delivery man. They couldn't really come to figure out what to do with him. So Bob got the idea that he wanted to buy the store. My dad said, ?If you want to buy or sell, give me a price and we'll decide what we'll do.? He gave my father a price and he bought the store. So he bought the Hollywood store, which was in Las Vegas. And my dad said, ?Okay, I'll move to Henderson since it's a one-man store, little, tiny store in Henderson and I'll be in Henderson and I'll run that.? And that's what happened. The problem was that Bob didn't know anything about the furniture business and six months later he had to sell it and he sold it to Max Goot. So Max Goot bought the store and ran that store successfully for quite a while. My dad was out in Henderson and had a heart attack. In those days, this is late '50s, when you had a heart attack, you literally...he was in the hospital for six weeks and they didn't want him to work anymore. They told him to retire. My dad was in his late fifties at the time. They didn't want him to work. So he sold the Hollywood store to a store called McMann's Furniture in Henderson and he retired. But after about a year he was feeling very, very good and he wanted to get back to work. He didn't feel like he should just lay around. So he did go to work for a store called Sheppard's Furniture, which along with Hollywood were the two leading furniture stores in Las Vegas. There was another store called Marianne's, which was a nice store. But Hollywood and Sheppard's were leading stores. So my father is now working at Sheppard's as the manager and Mr. Sheppard told him, ?If you do a good job, George, I'll let you buy in.? My dad said, ?Well, that's great.? But 14 after about four or five months he realized that Mr. Sheppard was on safaris and spending all the money; all the money that came in was all going out to Mr. Sheppard, and my dad didn't think that would be a very good thing to do. So he started his own business, left Sheppard's and started a new store and took a designer with him named George Garrett. And George Garrett had a following here in Las Vegas for interior design. So my dad was able to open a nice store and had a furniture store that he named Garrett's. That was a partnership that he had for a few years and that ended in about 1965 when George Garrett and him separated. My dad ran that store until I became involved in about 1968. Now, as a kid did you work in the store? I did; I worked in the store. What were your jobs as a kid? Cleaning mostly, vacuuming, dusting, unpacking, breaking down the trash, the cardboard boxes. I did a little bit of everything. I worked in the office. He actually had me do everything. I didn't work a lot for him, but I did work for him. It was kind of far away, so it just wasn't good. I actually worked at a grocery store, though, and got some retail experience at a grocery store with Art Lurie, who just recently passed away, too, a Las Vegas icon. He gave me my first job at Market Town as a box boy. Now, talk about working at the grocery store. That was one of my first jobs, too. Was it really? Yes. A great job. And Art Lurie was a great guy. Market Town was the grocery in town at the time; this is in the '60s. He probably had a hundred kids working any one time. So everybody got ten, twelve hours. It was a twenty-four-hour market, so he had us working all kinds of different hours, 15 but it was very safe. That was my first job, but furniture is what I ended up doing, not groceries. Okay. So the furniture business grows and...You were working with your dad? Yes, I was working with my dad. I kind of remember that there were?I think we counted in the fifties, maybe fifty furniture stores in Las Vegas in the late '50s. They were not all big. Doesn't that seem like a lot? There were a lot of used and small, but there were like fifty. When we opened Garrett's, we were at the bottom of the list; and when we closed our store in 2001, we were, I think, the oldest furniture store in town. I'm trying to think if there was anybody who was local that was here longer and I don't think there was. I think that was the oldest furniture store. He started that store in 1961. That's a long time. That is a pretty long time, from '61 to 2001; that's forty years. And passing a business on in a family is challenging. Yes. I respect that and I admire that it can work. It's interesting because he was a great partner. I don't know if it was because he was older and wanted to be able to take more time off. But he just said that you'll probably make some mistakes, but that's okay; you'll learn from them. I got married in 1973 to my wife, Lynn. By that time, he was really ready to spend a lot more time and he was going to Palm Springs and he really enjoyed it there. He had family, relatives from the Northwest in the winter there. So he was ready, but he was also ready to let me...So I was going to school and I was working. It was a very interesting time. By 1974 or so, he pretty much left the business to me and let me take care of it. We were partners for many