Transcript of interview with Don Hayden by Steven Cohen, March 1, 1979

UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden i An Interview with Don Hayden An Oral History Conducted by Steven Cohen Ralph Roske Oral History Project on Early Las Vegas Special Collections and Archives Oral History Research Center University Libraries University of Nevada, Las Vegas UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden ii © Ralph Roske Oral History Project on Early Las Vegas University of Nevada, Las Vegas, 2019 UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden iii The Oral History Research Center (OHRC) was formally established by the Board of Regents of the University of Nevada System in September 2003 as an entity of the UNLV University Libraries’ Special Collections Division. The OHRC conducts oral interviews with individuals who are selected for their ability to provide first-hand observations on a variety of historical topics in Las Vegas and Southern Nevada. The OHRC is also home to legacy oral history interviews conducted prior to its establishment including many conducted by UNLV History Professor Ralph Roske and his students. This legacy interview transcript received minimal editing, such as the elimination of fragments, false starts, and repetitions in order to enhance the reader's understanding of the material. All measures have been taken to preserve the style and language of the narrator. The interviewee/narrator was not involved in the editing process. UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden iv Abstract On March 1, 1979, collector Steven Cohen interviewed school administrator, Don Hayden (born in Ogden, Utah) in his home in Las Vegas, Nevada. This interview offers a historical overview of the education system in Nevada. Don also discusses gambling, the early atomic tests, the first hospitals built in Las Vegas, and offers his own personal account on home and family life in Nevada. UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 1 Date of the interview: February, no, March 1st, 1979. Place: Mr. Hayden’s address, 4120 Bonanza. Name of the collector: Steve Cohen. Address: 5014 Maryland Parkway. Okay. Don. Mm-hmm. I was wondering, can you give me a little background on your family? Any you know, children or anything? In my immediate family, yes, I—my wife (unintelligible) and I have a son that is now a teacher and baseball coach at Western High School. He graduated from Western. Then I have a daughter that’s a senior at Western High School and she’ll be going to the University of Nevada, I think Reno, and that’s my immediate family. Okay, when did you come to Nevada? I came to Nevada in 1940. In the fall of 1948, I had been going to school at Weber, which was a two year college then in Ogden, Utah. And I had taken some education courses and the superintendent of schools in McGill, Nevada, met me in Ogden and he was looking for a teacher and a coach and at that time you could teach in Nevada with a two year certificate. So, I had—hadn’t planned on going on to college. I was trying to make up my mind whether to go back into the service or to go on to college and when I had this opportunity to teach I thought, why, I’d like to try it out. So I did and I went to McGill, Nevada, in the fall of 1948, and McGill, Nevada was a company town owned by Kennecott Copper Mines. And I lived at the boarding house. I was single and everything in town was owned by Kennecott. There were no private industry there. You shopped at the company store and I had to eat all my meals at the boarding house or else go into Ely, Nevada—if I wanted to, any entertainment or to eat out. Where exactly is McGill? UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 2 McGill is in the central eastern part of the state and it’s about a hundred and it’s about two hundred miles, two hundred and fifty miles north of here. And it’s just— Close to Reno, is it? No, no, it’s on the way. It’s north of here. You go through Pioche and Caliente and Ely. Then you go on north, so you can go on north to Wells then (unintelligible) Idaho. It’s on the extreme eastern part of Nevada. So if they got the two year at Webber. Did you go on to a four year school? Yes. Then I—during the summers I went to, two summers at the University of Nevada at Reno. And then I transferred all my credits to Greeley, Colorado and finished my, B.A. degree during the summers at Greeley, Colorado. I left Nevada for one year and went to—married a girl from Idaho, that’s my present wife. Stayed there and taught one year and then went back to Greeley, and got my masters. After receiving my masters at Greeley, Las Vegas was beginning to grow and I knew the superintendent here who was Kyle Gray at the time, and I phoned Dr. Gray and asked him if there are any openings and at that time they were building three new schools. And that was in 1955. Which schools were they? It was John C. Fremont. We were kindergarten through eight and then four year high schools, at the time. And, they were building John C. Fremont, the Twin Lakes and the Lincoln schools. Those were all K through eight schools. At the time Rancho High School was just under construction and Las Vegas High was the only high school in Las Vegas proper. So between 1948 and 1955, you attended the University of Nevada, Reno? You went to Colorado to get the master’s degree, and you finally settled in Las Vegas in 1955? Right. UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 3 Okay. So, how did you get here—by car? We drove. You drove and how long did it take before you got your first employment? Here in Las Vegas? Yes. Or you had a job already set up? I had the position. They informed me that there were some jobs open, administrative positions, and at that time there were only a few of the educators in Clark County, or in Las Vegas. Las Vegas was a separate school district. And I think I happened to be one of about five or six people with a masters in administration at the time. And they hired me as the first principle of the new John C. Fremont School. So when you came in 1955 where was your first place of residency? In Twin Lakes. It was a new housing development along Tonopah highway now. And one of the newest housing developments in fact. And we moved right into there and lived there for twenty-one years. Twenty-one years and you know, I don’t want to get personal—how much did you pay for that house? Just to show how much things— Fourteen thousand. Fourteen thousand and what do you think the house would go for right now? Right now the property in that area is selling for—depending on whether you put additions on or a pool or something—but probably that home now and we didn’t have a pool, that home now would probably sell for close to forty thousand. Forty thousand. So from Twin Lakes in 1955, you started out as a principal of the school, as an administrator and what are some of the things you remember in the early days when UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 4 you came here? You know, some landmarks or the hotels or—you know, what comes to mind when you think of 1955, you’re just coming in? Well. I think probably in terms of the Strip, the old El Rancho, that has since burned, was a popular place—not only for visitors but also for the local people. The Desert Inn of course, was there and the Flamingo. The Stardust was under construction, or shortly after that. And the— Sahara Avenue was San Francisco Street, at that time. We didn’t have any of the freeways. Or people weren’t even thinking about freeways at the time. To show you a little bit about the—an idea of the population, as I recall, Las Vegas proper had about ten thousand students in school and—in all of the schools. That’s not counting the university, or (unintelligible)? No. Just in public schools, just k through eight. And—or I mean k through twelve. And now, I think the latest figures on school population in the county is somewhere in the neighborhood of eighty seven thousand. So you can see the growth just through the students enrolled in school. The school district changed three years after I arrived in 1955. In 1958, there were seven school districts and they combined those into one district and through the state legislature mandated that the schools throughout Nevada consolidate and formed the seventeen county school districts. So the Twin Lakes—how far is that from Downtown or—? It’s about four miles. So on this four mile stretch, was there any houses or stores or anything? There was, there was nothing. Nothing? UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 5 The Twin Lakes shopping center now, was—is new. Between the Twin Lake homes and Twin Lakes—what is known as Twin Lakes Lorenzi Park now, was a favorite place for the kids. There were no service stations, no shopping centers. No stores. No stores and—the main, the main street— Yes. What was the main street? The main street going Downtown from Twin Lakes was, we call Tonopah Highway now. And then go down Bonanza through the Westside under the underpass and that’s the way we’d go Downtown. Those hotels Downtown, were they up there, like the Mint and all those Downtown—that Casino Center area, which is known now? No. The Las Vegas Hotel and course the railroad station is where the Union Plaza is now. The railroad station. And—they had passenger service, they still had at that time, and that was the railroad station. So what’s your first—when you thought about, was the university here when you—in 1955? The University of Nevada, Las Vegas? Ah, the University of Nevada, Las Vegas was just starting and they held classes in the Las Vegas High School auditorium building and also in Las Vegas High School, Frazier Hall. (Unintelligible) classes. Did they go in one building? That Frazier Hall was the only building that was out there? Well, then they built—they started that after. I don’t know the exact date that they started the construction of the first building at the University of Nevada. It was in 1956 or seven, I believe. UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 6 I’m not—I’m not sure about that. But when the university started, they did use the building to Las Vegas High School, initially. You said your son, he went to Western High School? He went all through the school system here. Here in Las Vegas? From kindergarten through. And then, he went on to teach. You interested in any politics? Like in 1955 who was, you know, who was running the city? Democrats? Republicans? I think— Remember the mayor’s name or anything? You know, I should and I can’t— How about—the school systems? I recall the election when Mayor Gragson was elected and city commissioner then, City Commissioner Wendell Buckner ran against Mr. Gragson at that time. And that was some, probably now, twenty years ago. And I was wondering public transportation now, you know, I’m used to public transportation as the means of transportation. But around here, you know, I just don’t see it. Public transportation—is there any? Or what, you know, where’s the, what’s the future in that, public transportation? Is there buses around this neighborhood? There are buses—the Las Vegas transit system, the city buses that they call them is the only public transportation other than cabs that—well, cabs are private. That’s the only public transportation that we do have, I guess. UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 7 Okay. So Downtown was—you know, you said, two hotels and there was a few hotels on the Strip. Now, how about tourism? How much has that—has it grown? Oh. How about the airport? Tremendously. The airport? The old McCarran Airport, yes. Where is that at? Same—? It’s where the Hughes Airport is now. Not the one—it adjoins the McCarran Airport now. And—but that was the—that was the only air service in and out. And the old Hughes Air West, I believe, was the Bonanza Airlines at the time. So that tourism—what are you see in the future for it with, you know, with other states getting gaming? Do you think, you know, California seems to be the, you know, the backbone of our tourism. What do you think—? Okay. I was curious, in nineteen—you know, between 1955 and 1960, you know, what are some of the things you did, like for recreation? Where did you go, or? The mountains, beaches, or? Well. The main recreation I guess was if we wanted to go someplace and we used to go to the mountains quite often. A lot more than we do now—for picnics. We used to do some deer hunting in Northern Nevada, there’d be a group of us. And it was in the fall. I think probably attending sports, high school football games—tremendous rivalry between Las Vegas and Rancho, in those early years. The basketball, I think probably the sports events, high school sports events in those days, the early days, gave the people more of the recreation than probably anything else, for the home town people. In those days too I think the local people used to go UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 8 Downtown or would go to the hotels more often than they do now. Simply because there wasn’t that large number of people and you didn’t have to push your way through the hotels and it was a much more hometown atmosphere. I can remember Howard Wasdin, we have a school named after Howard now. A native Nevadan. And he’s since retired. We went to a show at the Fremont Hotel, a lounge show and it was Wayne Newton and his brother, and they were all in the lounge at the Fremont Hotel. And this was back in the—around 1960 because I’d just opened up Roy Martin Junior High School new, and Wayne and his brother came down and played for an assembly for the kids. And it was shortly after that then that he started playing the larger hotels. Remember anything of the other stores in 1950, you know, in the early days? Well. Or people that made it, people that didn’t make it. On the Strip (unintelligible) the sign? No. I don’t recall, particularly any that didn’t make it. We used to—we’d always try to see Jimmy Durante when he was in town. He used to be in quite often at the Desert Inn. Belton Burrow. And it was easy, I say easy, I’d say easy, it was—it seemed to be easier, just a sort of a normal thing to do, to go to one of the shows. But now I think probably, it’s more, a little more difficult to get into the shows sometimes. A little more expensive, I guess and— What did it cost—let’s say, you wanted to go see Jimmy Durante on a Saturday night? Oh. You could, if you went to the, one of the late shows, it would be four dollars a person. Oh yes. Four dollars? Mm-hmm. And gambling you were—like when you—when you lived up in that mining town, was there gaming up there? In Ely. UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 9 Ely? Mm-hmm. And then, is McGill they had one bar and pool hall and it was owned by some of the company officials, of course. And that used to be the gathering place. That mining company, is that still there? It (unintelligible) just, they just closed up about a year ago. They couldn’t meet the qualifications for the— They became obsolete? Environmental program. It cost too much to mine—the open mining pit was at Ruth, Nevada. And they had to ship the ore by rail to McGill. And that’s where the smelter was. And it got just too expensive to mine plus the Environmental Protection Agency began requiring so much that it would be too expensive for them to comply with their regulations on smoke control and gas control. So they closed it down. Where did everybody go? McGill is still operating. Oh yes? All with a skeleton crew, I understand. But there was probably twelve, fourteen hundred people have been laid off in the last three years. (Unintelligible). And some of them came here. You’ve seen some? Some of the people have moved down here. Some went to other parts of Nevada. Mm-hmm. Some stayed and are going to (unintelligible). UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 10 Have you ever been back to McGill or Ely? Oh. I go—go through every once in a while. How many people live out there? In the town of Ely? I would suspect that there’s, in White Pine County, that’s Ely, Ruth, and McGill, I would suspect there’s probably around ten thousand people, in the county. So 1955, how many people lived there? Oh. Fifteen, sixteen thousand. So there was more than—? Right. Then there is now? Right. White Pine High School, their enrollment is probably down from a hundred or two hundred, I wouldn’t, I haven’t kept that close to it, but their enrollment is down. They used to be—one of the powerhouse athletic teams in the state was White Pine County High School. So it’s—in some communities instead of an appreciation, people, you know, are starting to leave those kind of towns up there? And it’s because of the industry, I guess, right? Right. Right now, they’re trying to—they’re doing a lot of oil. Mm-hmm. There are some oil producing oil wells in White Pine now, just in recent years and there’s a lot of exploration going on up there. Now gambling, is it important to you? Like do you gambling or anything? Well. When I was in Ely or McGill and Ely, and single, I gambled a little bit. You were gambling? How bad— Not— UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 11 Nothing now? Not now. You have a family. You become immune to it I guess, after a while. Yes. And do you remember anything about the atomic tests? The first big one that went off was, that I can remember, in 1950, I was in Ely. And I know all of us—we knew the time of day and it was during the school hours and all the kids went out and thinking that we would see or hear something. But we—I don’t recall that we did. Then when we came down here, I had followed it pretty closely, the shots. The big publicity that’s going now, publicly in the papers, people that have claimed that they have contracted diseases because of that. I—I’ve never been afraid of it. I was wondering a newspaper media cover, how much has that changed like since 1955? And how many newspapers, was there a TV, you know, the radio stations, you know, that seems to grow first. What’s your impressions on the media? Well. We still had the Journal and of course the Journal has changed hands. I think—at least we did—I took both newspapers mainly because of the different editorials, I guess, between the Journal and the Sun. And ‘course Hank Greenspun was with the Sun. And the Journal had the Caymans and it has since changed hands and is now owned by a big chain, I guess, Don Ray. But those were the two major newspapers and still are. And still are? Was there any other—papers that have come and gone since then? No. There’s a few—the Valley Times, of course, is now one of the—I guess you could include as one of the three major newspapers. There’s been some newspapers put out by independent groups and— UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 12 So in 1955 when you came, how many elementary—how many schools were there in Las Vegas? Just those three? Well. Las Vegas High School was in Las Vegas, proper. Because it was still a separate school district then and not a county. They had Boulder City, and Henderson, Moapa and Virgin Valley, and they had one school in Paradise Valley, which is still the Paradise School—elementary school. And they had their own superintendent, only one school. Las Vegas High School was the only high school. Rancho was under construction and just moved. They were just having they’re first classes in 1955. The—there, we had Madison School and Westside School on the Westside area. K through Eight schools. J. D. Smith and the Twin Lakes was a new school. I can’t—right off the top of my head I can’t (unintelligible). So now they have junior high schools? Uh-huh. Then in 1958, when we went to a county system, we went into a junior high school system. Hyde Park was the first new junior high school. They converted J. D. Smith and they converted Fremont from elementary. They added on the gymnasiums and some classrooms and made them junior high schools. Okay. Now your wife, does your wife work? Yes. My wife, when we first came here, worked at the Southern Memorial Hospital as a nurse. And that was when? And now she—she worked there for a couple of years and then didn’t work again until about six years ago, and she’s working with a sheriff’s department in a business license. In that department. Did she go to—was she educated in Nevada? No. She was educated in Idaho and in college in Portland, Oregon. Now your son, he went to the University of Nevada, Reno? UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 13 No. He went all through twelve years here in Las Vegas and then transferred, or started college at ASU and then transferred to Southern Utah, in Cedar City, and graduated from there. And you have a daughter? That’s a senior in high school. And she’s going to be going to—? She’s trying to decide between Reno and UNLV. And what kind of—like your wife, when she first got here in 1955, she started at the hospital, where was that hospital at? It’s at its present location. And—? But then only just the one building. And how many buildings does it have now? If it only had one building. Well. They’re under a big expansion program now. And they’ve added on the wings to the existing building. And it’s really expanded. It’s much larger. Then of course, that was the only hospital at the time. Do you remember any old ranches or anything? Any ranch property around here? Well. The present site that the Elks Lodge is on, at 900 Las Vegas Boulevard North, the old ranch house restaurant used to be there and it used to be a favorite eating place in town. You had to cross a little bridge and it had water running, a little stream running though where the Old Fort is. That was probably, the Old Fort is probably the oldest landmark, and which is now owned by the city. You belonged to that Elks Club, right? Yes. UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 14 What type of club is that? It’s a fraternal organization for men. We do a lot of charitable work. And just recently, in the past year, through funds raised at our Helldorado, which the Elks sponsor, we donated some money to the university scholarship program for four scholarships. And there are many other charitable things that we do, but we really don’t publicize it. The Elks Lodge here, probably more so than any other Elks Lodge in the States, has contributed greatly to the growth of Nevada, I think. In what ways? I’ve mentioned a couple of times to people that if you walk through the hallway in the Elks Lodge and look at the pictures of the past exalted rulers it, you could almost—if you could have interviewed some of those gentlemen you’d get a history of Las Vegas. Harley Harmon Senior, and (unintelligible), and Dr. J. D. Smith, who is still alive. Dr. Roy Martin, who was one of the first medical doctors here in town. Do you know these—? All (unintelligible). Do you know these fellows? I know some of them that are still alive. I see Dr. J. D. Smith quite often. Would be a remarkable fellow to talk to. How old is he? I think Dr. Smith is in his eighties. K. O. Knudsen. The K. O. Knudsen School is named after an educator here, for many, many years. He’s still alive and attends the meetings. K. O. is blind now but hardly misses a Thursday night and he’s in his eighties. I believe K. O. is eighty-three. One UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 15 of the first and one of the finest and most successful educators in Clark County, in the State of Nevada. I was wondering, do you remember any kind of political leaders or any special events that have come to Las Vegas, over the years? You know any presidents or you know any—? Not since the building of the dam, I believe—I don’t remember now. The dam. When was that built? Think it was in the late thirties, middle thirties I think, when it was finished. There was a president—I wasn’t here at the time. I think the thing was, and not just because I belong to the Elks now, but I think one of the outstanding things that they used to have and they’re trying to rebuild is the Helldorado days, western celebration. It’s changed over the years because the town has changed. I don’t understand. What is that? The Helldorado. Big western celebration that—in May every year. Well, where do they have that? It’s sponsored by the Elks. We have it at the Convention Center now. The big rodeo and one week of carnival and the swap meet and— When did that start? This year it—this year it will be May 19th through the 27th. Do you remember, when was the first year they had it? Forty-five years ago. Maybe 1934. So in nineteen—wait did you remember like in 1955 or 1960 when they had it? Oh yes. Yes? UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 16 It was a big thing, then. School—they used to let school out on Thursday, the first parade, we used to have three parades, we only have one now. But they’d let all of the schools out. The first one that I can recall I believe, they had the Budweiser (unintelligible) horses in the parade. The parade was always, then, led by some celebrity. It was either that year or the year after that James Arness, Matt Dillon led the parade. One year during those first few years I was here, it was televised nationally, the Sunday beauty parade. All the hotels used to have huge floats, beautiful floats in the parade. And as I say the town attracted more tourists, the hotels sort of phased out putting floats in the parade and it sort of lost the Old West flavor. And then, when we moved into Convention Center— That was it. I guess it really did lose part of the Old West flavor. Where was the Convention Center? That wasn’t always the site of it? No. We used to have it at the old Cashman Field, down in back of the Elks Lodge. The Cashman Field. It was an outside rodeo. And what year was the Convention Center built? Do you remember that? Oh golly. Convention Center was started somewhere around 1958, I believe. And you remember when they were building it up there? I—yes, I can remember when it was going up. And what was the first use—what were they going to use that for? That Convention Center? Were they—it was strictly tourism? It was strictly for conventions and tourism and—and also, to be used as a community center type place. They started playing university basketball games in their later. When the university started UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 17 big time. And I can recall that they would have youth activities. The Optimus Clubs used to have youth day and they’d have—be able to use the Convention Center. School groups would use it and it, over the years had been a community center. Now I—they have so many conventions coming in that it’s difficult to—to schedule any local activities in there anymore. Right. Do you think this, this is gonna, you know, get back to the old days in popularity? This— The Helldorado? Helldorado. I think this year we’re making an all-out attempt. We’re spending a lot of money on advertising and we’re putting in something new. We’re going to have a western show and Rick Nelson and George Goober Lindsey and we’re getting some of the big names back like we used to. And—to try to get it back to where it was. And who—? And most of our funds that we raise from this goes into our community activities. We give a lot of scholarships. We—at Christmas time still give baskets and we take the children at Child Haven on shopping sprees and we have a big dinner and entertainment and prizes and bingo for the senior citizens. Just a number of things and we have—we have a program of shoes for the needy throughout the year. Just all kinds of programs. And this has been going on for forty-five years, huh? This would be the forty-fifth year. And the Elks Club sponsored it? Right. For forty-five years? UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 18 It—it started back in 1934, when some of the townspeople got together and decided they needed something to stimulate some interest and some funds and to keep the spirit of the Old West alive, I guess. And so, some of the businessmen started the first Helldorado and rodeo. And from then it grew and grew and when it began to—they needed some kind of a continuity and somebody to sponsor it, so the Elks Lodge—most of the men at that time, businessmen were members of the Elks and they agreed to take it over. Well, the Elks Club, who makes it up? You know, how do you get into it? You have to be twenty-one. And someone in the club has to sponsor you and then— But it’s usually long time residence of the—? No. (Unintelligible) We’re getting a lot of young fellows in now. Yes. Which we need. And— I was wondering, you have any relatives that you know, lived in Nevada or? No. No. Or from Utah. My—no my relatives are all from Missouri. Missouri? I just happened to go to Weber College after I got out of the Navy and I knew somebody in Ogden and visited and the college was there and it interested me and I stayed. How many hospitals were here then? Or med—you know, doctors, or, you know, when you first got here? UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 19 Southern Memorial Hospital was here and I believe—I’m not sure, but I—I believe the Women’s Hospital was over on Charleston. Mm-hmm. Or at least it was shortly after, when we arrived. But there was the big streets then that the hospital—like Maryland Parkway and Paradise Road? Oh no. When I opened Fremont School in 1955—that was at the edge of the desert. There was nothing—no paved roads past there. But where’s that at now that Fremont School? Well, it’s on East Saint Louis, just a block from Maryland, off of Maryland Parkway and Sahara, which I—was then, Sahara was San Francisco Street and that was it. That was the edge of town. And that was it? And then—? On beyond that there were no paved roads. There were no houses, no (unintelligible). And then it just kind of spread out over there. Where’s it—what’s next for Las Vegas? You know, what’s ‘gonna happen next? Is it ‘gonna—is it ‘gonna keep on growing or well, see, you’re talking about this Ely and these other towns that seem to—you know, they had their time, you know, they had the people there and they kind of moved away. With the transient type living here, do you think it’s ‘gonna just get out of hand? Or? Oh, it looks like Las Vegas and Reno are ‘gonna continue to grow. Right now Reno is experiencing a growth like we did in the sixties and I understand that the past few months in Reno, why, especially last summer, it was very difficult to find a place to live. All the new hotels opening up and— You’ve been there? Reno? UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 20 Yes. When was the first time you were at Reno? I—in 1949. 1949? Now what do you remember about that? Oh. It was a small town. Just a—? Well. You know, everybody—I say everybody. At least Nevadans always thought of Reno as the hometown type. The friendly place. And still to some extent, people look at Reno as the friendly Nevada town. Although, when we came to Las Vegas it was like that. You could walk Downtown in Las Vegas in 1955 and six, in the early fifties and know almost everybody that you’d see. And that’s the thing I guess that, that I miss most is seeing people that you know, even in the school district, I used to see everybody in the school district, because we were so small. And now? And now, people I’ve known for twenty-four, twenty-five years, hardly see. I—the first basketball team that the university had, Chub Drakulich was the coach, and he had been the coach at Rancho High School. And the university played mostly junior colleges in Saint George, in Cedar City, and some teams in California, and to travel—for the team to travel, they used a large stretch-out bus that was owned by the school district. And the only way they could use it is if somebody from the school district drove it. So, being a good friend of Coach Drakulich, he was a—he asked me to go with him on the basketball trips. So that’s—I helped drive the bus and travel with the university basketball team. That was the first team they had over there? That’s the first, first team they had. UNLV University Libraries Don Hayden 21 Remember any of the player’s names back then? Oh. In those early days there was Don Helm, who is now on the Metro Police Force. Burney (Unintelligible). Course Cilice Step was much later than that. Dr. Demine’s boy, and I can’t remember his name, was one of the early players. A doctor? What’s his name? Dr. Demine? Dr. Demine. And— So when did it start to grow? The team? The school? Did it grow the same or? Or the team—? They got a—? They figured they got a big name basketball team and that would spark interest? Put the highlight on Las Vegas? Oh. It came much later. Okay.