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Transcript of interview with Velma Holland by Beatrice Scheid, April 6, 1976






On April 6, 1976, collector Beatrice Scheid interviewed housewife Velma Holland (born October 17th, 1903 in New Market, Iowa) in her home in Boulder City, Nevada. This interview covers her early life in Boulder City. Mrs. Holland, Connie Degennes, and Beatrice Scheid are present during the interview.

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Holland, Velma Interview, 1976 April 6. OH-00876. [Transcript.] Oral History Research Center, Special Collections and Archives, University Libraries, University of Nevada, Las Vegas. Las Vegas, Nevada.


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UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland i An Interview with Velma Holland An Oral History Conducted by Beatrice Scheid Ralph Roske Oral History Project on Early Las Vegas Special Collections and Archives Oral History Research Center University Libraries University of Nevada, Las Vegas UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland ii © Ralph Roske Oral History Project on Early Las Vegas University of Nevada, Las Vegas, 2019 UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland iii The Oral History Research Center (OHRC) was formally established by the Board of Regents of the University of Nevada System in September 2003 as an entity of the UNLV University Libraries’ Special Collections Division. The OHRC conducts oral interviews with individuals who are selected for their ability to provide first-hand observations on a variety of historical topics in Las Vegas and Southern Nevada. The OHRC is also home to legacy oral history interviews conducted prior to its establishment including many conducted by UNLV History Professor Ralph Roske and his students. This legacy interview transcript received minimal editing, such as the elimination of fragments, false starts, and repetitions in order to enhance the reader's understanding of the material. All measures have been taken to preserve the style and language of the narrator. The interviewee/narrator was not involved in the editing process. UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland iv Abstract On April 6, 1976, collector Beatrice Scheid interviewed housewife Velma Holland (born October 17th, 1903 in New Market, Iowa) in her home in Boulder City, Nevada. This interview covers her early life in Boulder City. Mrs. Holland, Connie Degennes, and Beatrice Scheid are present during the interview. UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 1 I am interviewing Mrs. Fred Holland. 418 Ash Street, Boulder City, Nevada, regarding her experiences during the building of Boulder Dam. (Unintelligible) I am Beatrice Sheid. A member of AAUW. Mm-hmm. Of Boulder City. 4676. Is that ready? Well, my home was in Colorado. And we were married in Cheyenne, Wyoming, when my husband was at the University there, taking rehabilitation under the Veteran’s Administration. We lived in Denver for a while. But we were told that there was work at the automobile plants in Detroit. So we went to Detroit. And we were there, about a little over two years. And our oldest son Fred Junior, was born April 28th, 1926. And so his mother came and she made California sound like it was a utopia, so we loaded up and started to California. And we left on the 3rd of July, 1926, and passed through Chicago on the 4th of July. They—we picked up the highway, which was the old Lincoln highway, and it wasn’t much more than a trail. And we got along fairly well, and each night we pitched our tent and in Nebraska, I’ve forgotten where, we stopped and I put my corner in the—for the gas plate, and put the food on to cook, and I went to tend to the baby and when I came back someone had pushed my pan off and had cooked their dinner. And the gas was all out. So I put another quarter in and finished cooking my dinner. We came on across to Northern Nevada or Utah, to the salt flats. And we had three flat tires, and we came to Wells, Nevada, and we pitched our camp there. They had a vacant spot there. And they had a sign up for camping, and our cooking facilities was a tin tub, washtub, turned upside down, with a stove pipe out of it and a hole to put the wood in with a sign saying use as little as possible. So we got up then and started down to Reno, and the road was an old railroad bed where they had taken up the tires and the rails and all, and all they had left was just UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 2 the ridges. And before we left Detroit, my brother-in-law had made a nice cupboard, and fixed it and bolted it on to the side of the car, for our food and cooking utensils, and on that (Laughs) rough road, it came unfastened, someway, and the front let down. It was (unintelligible) the front let down as a table. Hm. And that fell down and out come all of the food and the dishes and pans and the eggs was all down there and broken. Mm-hmm. So we gathered up what we could and put it back together. And fastened it a little more solid. So we went on to Sparks and we stayed all night and then we got up the next morning and we started out, we had a little better roads. So we came over the mountains, and Mother Holland, wanted to take the baby with them, she and Tom. And give me a little rest. But we said, no. And it’s a good thing we did, because we got separated. They took one road and we took the other. They went by way of Lake Tahoe, and we went around Donner Lake. Saw the place where the people had—so many had died. We arrived— Were they killed by the Indians? Hmm? Were they killed by the Indians? Or? No. They—they were stranded there and they—the people died of starvation. Yes. And they (unintelligible)—so we arrived at the sisters, and Mother Holland and Tom came in a few hours later, and they were so worried that we were stranded somewhere up on the mountain. But as we came over the mountains, we came to Immigrant Pass, and our old Ford— UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 3 Mm-hmm. Wouldn’t pull the grade and we had to back down and turn around and back up over the grade. (Laughs) Mother Holland and Tom, see I guess (unintelligible) get on there that they came in later. Yes. So we stayed there and Mr. Holland and Tom, they went out to look for work, and at that time there was no fruit workers needed. So they went over to Petaluma and at that time, that was called the egg basket of the world. And so they—in the meantime, they needed some help at the packing sheds. So I went to work there cutting peaches to be canned and I put my baby in the nursery. And in three weeks, he got chicken pox. (Laughs) So then, Mr. Holland, he found a place that he thought was gonna be work for a while. So he came over and got us and we went over to one of the chicken ranches, and some had twenty-five hundred laying hens up to thirty-thousand hens. And they took flat-rack trucks and big galvanized buckets to gather the eggs. And they’d come in with those great big flat-rack trucks, with these big buckets sitting on there. Full of eggs that they had gathered. So I graded eggs. And we got our house furnished and all of our utilities, and (Laughs) all the eggs we could use. And we were there, I think about five years, and in that five years, we had the daughter and the younger son. And we had heard that there was a possibility that there might be a bill put through that they would build the dam. So we watched the papers and we didn’t like California, it was too damp, and Mr. Holland had arthritis so bad. So we packed up and Mother Holland wanted to come with us. So we bought a truck and loaded our furniture on it, and Tom said, well, he’d come, too. So then, the brother-in-law was there, he decided that there wasn’t too much work around, and he’d come and help Tom with the driving on the truck. The LA Highway wasn’t so hot either. So we arrived in Las Vegas, Easter Sunday, UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 4 April the 5th, 1931. That was forty-five years ago, forty-six years ago, Sunday. We couldn’t find a place to stay. People had cots on their porches and around the courthouse, on the lawn, were bedrolls where people would sleep at night, and roll up their bed and put it by a tree and go out around somewhere, and then they’d come back later. We went to the filling station, and the attendant told us, he thought that if he went back out to Arden, ten miles out, and found Mr. Strauss, that he could maybe help us. So we went out there and found Mr. Strauss, and we found a house that was built on hollow tile. The blocks were as big as these big cinderblocks, but they weren’t the cinderblocks, they were tile. And they were cool in the summer. We lived there until May. And we didn’t think about having a cooler of any kind. It was so nice and cool. And we didn’t realize what the heat would be by living there. So a while after we were there, it was—or we moved in to Las Vegas, and Six Companies had built some dormitories, up on the side of the cliffs down there, in the canyon thinking that the men could stay there, and save the travelling time, you know, coming back and forth up here. But it was so hot that they couldn’t stand it. Mm-hmm. And it got from a hundred and fifteen to a hundred and twenty. And so, Mr. Holland in the meantime had been looking for a place for us to live. And so, finally somebody said that the U. S. Marshall had a place. And so, he contacted him, and he had a little tent house, and we bought it and the yard was so nice and neat and it was all outlined with rocks about the same size, and then up here it says U. S. Marshall. And I have a picture of that. Mm-hmm. And— Do you remember how much you paid for it? UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 5 I think we paid twenty-five dollars. And it had a wooden floor, and the sides had been raised and it was all screened. And the sides had been raised and framed. And out, you know, it couldn’t rain in. And that let the air through, and—but I’m getting ahead of myself. When we got out there and got this house, the brother-in-laws, they were back on the highway somewhere with the truck. So, Mr. Holland, he asked me—he said, “You stay here with the children.” And he says, “We’ll go back out the highway and meet them. And save them driving on in to town and back.” So they went ahead and they met ‘em and they came in and as they came over Mountain Pass, their breaks went out. And they came down—I think they’ve changed that road now. I haven’t been over it for years. But that was a long grade coming down Mountain Pass, and they came down there with no breaks. And there was a big old desert turtle in the road. (Laughs) And Tom, he began to figure what he was gonna do, whether he was gonna try to pull aside and miss it, or drive over it or what. So he did, luckily. It was in the middle of the road. And he just drove over it and went on. He said, that if he had hit it, that it may have thrown the truck out of control, or even turned them over. Mm-hmm. So they had kind of a hair-raising experience. Well, anyway, I’ll get back to out here. And they—so we stayed—we left Las Vegas and came out here and was coming down the grade to the river down to Williamsville, later known as Rag Town, and the moon was shining. It was about nine o’clock at night. And the moon was shining on that river, and it was the most beautiful silver strand you ever saw in your life. And it was about that time that that song was popular, where the silver Colorado (unintelligible). Well, there it was. And I seemed to get a thrill out of it. I knew the song and there was a silver Colorado. Well, we pulled in and just took enough off of the truck to fix beds. And we went to bed and we got up the next morning, and I UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 6 looked out, and right down there, was that awful fast rolling thick brick colored stuff that had looked so beautiful the night before in the moonlight. And at night we would go down there, and I don’t think we were more than a block from it. We would go down there and we had milk cans. And we’d fill those up, dip the water, and fill those up, and take ‘em back up, let ‘em sit overnight, pour the water off and then we’d have to scrap the silt out of the cans—that had settled. And it was so hot. And for the children to take naps, I would take clean sheets, and dip ‘em in the water, and hang one over the door, and put one on the floor for them to lie down on and take their naps. So we lived there until it was getting pretty close to school time. And Fred had been to kindergarten in California. And it was getting time for him to start first grade. This was in 1931? And. Wasn’t it? Nineteen thirty-one. Mm-hmm. And there—there was no provisions that I knew of down there, you know, that they were preparing for any kind of a school. I don’t think they ever had one down there. They may have, I don’t know. But I hadn’t heard of any. So (Laughs) we dismantled our little tent house and loaded it up and we came back up the grade and we’d come up around and we parked right up here where Denver and Colorado come together under that hill. The water tank wasn’t there, then. And there was several other campers there. Hm. UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 7 The Skies family was there. And I can’t remember the other names. And so we set our tent up, and I spent all day, nailing that floor down. And I was just about finished when the Marshall came by and he said, “Mrs. Holland, I’m awfully sorry.” But he said, “You have move.” (Laughs) I said, “Well, where do we go now?” And so he pointed back over here to the Y across the tracks from the depot. And he said, you can go over there. And he said, you can stay as long as you want to. Well, Mr. Holland came home (Laughs) and he looked things over and he said, “You didn’t get very much accomplished today.” And I said, “No.” I said, “The Marshall came by and said we had to move.” And he said, “Well, where are we gonna go? And why do we have to move?” And I said, “Well, he said that these other people around here and Bureau of Reclamation and we were Six Company. And we have to move.” And I said, “He pointed over there behind the depot, and he said, we can go over there in what they call the Y. And we can pitch our tent and stay as long as we wanted to.” So (Laughs) we pulled up stakes and loaded up and we moved again. Went over in the Y and we got over there and there was the Godbey’s and the Cayenne’s came along shortly after. And the Barkley’s and elders and I—I can’t think but I think there was about fifty camps or so, over there. So it was coming closer to school time. And Mr. Elder, he was a bachelor, and he lived just across the driveway from us. And he said, that if Six Companies would give him a load of lumber, scrap lumber that he would build a room, and he had a sister in Flagstaff that was a teacher. And he would ask her to come over here. And gather up all the books she could find and come over here, and teach those children in the Y. So he talked to Six Companies—men, and one day here come a big, big load of lumber. And it wasn’t scrap, it was good lumber. So the men around, they got their hammers and their saws, and they went over and helped him and they built this room. It was about the size of this room. And UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 8 they put windows in and everything. And they took the lumber built desks and benches. And I can remember when I went to school, the little country schoolhouse, that that’s what we had, was a next, you know, with the benches fastened on to ‘em. And two sided each desk. So—and then, for the blackboards, they just took the black roofing paper, felt paper, and nailed it out. And so, Mrs. Bissell, she gathered up the books and she came over, and she started the school, and I have a picture of that somewhere. And I think there were about eighteen or twenty youngsters in there. The Godbey’s, I think there were was two of the Godbey boys. And I think there was two of the Barkley boys. And Fred Junior, and I can’t remember the other names. But anyway—and they got a hold of one by two or something, and nailed it up. And put the flag on it. And there was the stars and stripes, over the little schoolhouse sitting out in the middle of the desert. So Fred went to school until spring there. And then, we moved into the Six Companies house. They couldn’t build ‘em fast enough. They had so many on the list. And so Godbey’s, they got tired waiting though and they leased the lot and built their own house. And we had been to the lumber yard and I had Mike Sneed figure what it would cost us to build. And we would lease the lot from the Bureau of Reclamation. But in the meantime, Mr. Holland came home, and he said, “Well.” He said, “They scratched my name off the list today.” He says, “We got a house.” Well, we packed up and moved into the house, and we were at 713 Seventh Street, way, way down. They still didn’t have a school so there were several women who took children into their homes. So Fred went to Mrs. Larson, and I believe she lived on—I don’t know if she lived on B or C. But anyway, he went to, Mrs. Larson. And then, they got the school and he started in and the Boulder City School. And by that time Hazel was ready for kindergarten, and they didn’t have room over there for a kindergarten. So the kindergarten was down in the basement under the city manager’s office. The original building that the Masonic Hall is built unto, that was the city manager’s UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 9 office, and so forth. And somebody said, the jail was down underneath. Well, I don’t know anything about that. But there was a room down there and Mrs. Stanford was her teacher. And she had quite a group, in kindergarten. And then, as time went on, why, everything began to improve, and Boulder City built up a little more. And you felt a little more like you were living. (Laughs) And we moved in the house. And we had this one lightbulb hanging down on a cord. And— Was that in 19—? That was really something. Was that in 1932? The— That was in 1932. Mm-hmm. And so—then, they—for church, I can’t remember, but there was a little house down at the end of D or somewhere down there, where we had Sunday school. And we had children, was sitting on—it was a schoolroom, and the children was sitting at the desk and on top of the desk. And standing up against the wall. And I can’t remember who the teacher was. And of course the streets were just sand. And maybe you’d get stuck and maybe you didn’t. And at that time, I didn’t drive. I had driven before that. But when the children were small, I didn’t drive. I was afraid that I might have my attention detracted from my driving and—with them, and I’d have an accident. So I didn’t drive for several years. And so then, they got around and decided to build Grace Church. And they didn’t have the money so they—I forget what they called it. They were interdenominational something, I think in New York. They borrowed the money to build Grace Church. So we were there when they took the first shovel of dirt out. And they built the church and it’s sitting there all by itself and all the vacant country around it. And it doesn’t look anything like it does now. So they had a pretty full congregation, and I taught Sunday school there. Leo Dunbar was superintendent of the Sunday school and I taught the UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 10 Sunday school. And I taught Sunday school on through wartime, I guess. And Mrs. Courtney, she had the kitchen, and she had the big sandbox made that rolled underneath the work table in the kitchen, and she’d take the little ones in there. And Charles, I guess he was about, oh, maybe a little over a year and a half, he was in her class. So she’d take all these little ones in there and shut the door and pull the sandbox out. And she would cut out, you know, the different people in the Bible, you know. Hm. She’d cut ‘em off and put the names on them, you know. Hm. And she built the church and they took weeds and set ‘em out, you know, through trees and shrubs. And they was the cutest outfit. (Unintelligible) So, she had the (unintelligible) department, and during the war, the Iman’s were here. But before that though, when the church opened, Parson Tom Stevenson, was our minister. He came from California. And I think it was on a Christmas Eve, they had been out caroling, and they had come back to the church and had a chili dinner. And he knew of someone that he thought, maybe didn’t have enough food, and he had a kettle of chili that he was gonna take to these people and he came out of the church and started to cross the street and somebody, I don’t remember anymore who it was—come down the street so fast, on Wyoming, that it hit him, and knocked him out of his shoes. Hm. And killed him. Just killed him, instantly. Well, that was a—I think Boulder City’s first tragedy. And— UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 11 When exactly was that? The Iman’s came in and she taught Sunday school, too. About what—? When was that, do you said about? Hm? Boulder City’s first tragedy. About when? What year? Well, that must’ve been pretty close to—that must have been the late thirties because the Iman’s were here during the war. Oh. From ’41. Now, can we go back and tell me something about your husband’s first job out at the dam? Oh. We’d like to cover the early—? Well. He— Part of the year. (Unintelligible) (Tape one ends) Mr. Holland was among the first high scalers down in the canyon. And they hung seven hundred feet down the canyon on a rope. And in the late thirties, two brother-in-laws came out and they—two sister-in-laws and I—the three of us, never left home, all at one time. You just, when they’d leave one morning, you didn’t know whether they were coming back at night. And I—they had a mortuary here. And I don’t know why they took it away but anyway, I have seen—seen ‘em bring ‘em up—the bodies up to the mortuary, on the—just, you know, on the flatbed truck. And UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 12 so, but if the two of us went why, one would stay home, in case, you know, that there was anything. It was a very dangerous (unintelligible)? It was, yes. They were hanging there, seven hundred, as much as seven hundred feet on a rope. And it was coming out over those rocky ledges up there. And moving back and forth, those ropes could saw in two. And they had this rigging. I think they used ten to twenty foot steels, bits, you know, drill ‘em back in to the walls of the canyon, to load the powder in to blow off the side. And I noticed in the birthday addition, someone mentioned the explosions they had and blowing off the walls. But they didn’t say anything about the high scalers that got up there and hung on the ropes and put those holes in there to load with the powder to blow ‘em off. Mm-hmm. So he worked on that until they finished that part of it. And then, as they started to build the forums and get ready to pour concrete, they laid pipe in this cement. Did I do something? No. I just wondered what the high scalers were paid. Did they get paid extra for their dangerous work? I think it was five dollars and sixty cents a day. Was that more than the other workers? Five sixty. The highest they ever paid was nine dollars, and that was to the painters, that he later worked with. Hm. But they laid this—they called it the cooling pipe. And you know, the dam was poured in these box, you know, they’d pour so many, and then, they’d go over here to pour some in. Then they’d go back and pour these. And they run this pipe through there, run the water through to help to UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 13 cool to cure the concrete, so it would set up. And the, later, I think that he worked with the pipefitters. And then, he was a painter at the Ford factory in Detroit. So he went back to the painter, and he transferred to the Bureau of Reclamation for the painting. And he painted then as they worked in the dam and they put in all of those switch yards and turbines and one thing and another, generators, he painted on those. And let’s see, and the brother Tom, he was a truck driver and he drove those huge mac trucks that hauled away the debris and everything that was down there. And so then when they got that done, he went over to the Bureau of Reclamation with the rangers. So Mr. Holland painted until, oh dear, I can’t think of it. Well, I think you have covered pretty much, the early beginnings of the dam. Yes. Well. Can you think of any—? I think he—he worked as a painter for the Bureau of Reclamation. And then, during the war, he quit the painting and went over to the Bureau of Reclamation, and he was a ranger. And that’s when they convoyed the cars across the dam. Hm. They had the rangers at each side and they’d let so many cars get there. And then, there would be a ranger in the last car, and one in the first car. And they convoyed those cars, back and forth across the dam. And— That was before the bridge and all of that other was built, right? All, yes, uh-huh. They had the ferry that Murl Emery operated the ferry across the river. And I know we went to Kingman one time, and we had to cross the ferry. And the current was so swift, that (Laughs) that was a thrill. It took that raft down, circle around and come back up. And I wondered if the cables were gonna take it where it was supposed to go. (Laughs) UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 14 Was this during the war—that Murl Emery had this ferry? No. During the war, they had it, the road was open over the dam. But this was before they had opened it. But then, he—after the war, he worked for Bureau of Mines, over here. And in June 1947, he was up on a twenty foot ladder, with all of this spray gun equipment that they had to use, and there was a man that drew the same pay he did, that was supposed to stand at the foot of that ladder, so nothing could bump it. And for some reason, no one ever knew, that man left that ladder and it slid out from under him and he fell twenty feet, and he just fell flat, on the concrete, and he tried to break his fall with his hands and he shattered both wrists. And he was never able to do anything, you know, move his wrists this way. Now he could take a hammer and use leverage with his arm, or a saw or something, but to do anything with his hand, this way, he could never—he lost his trade. Do you remember what pay he received when he was—? He was getting nine sixty. A day? Nine sixty a day. Mm-hmm. That was in 1947? That was in 19— Mm-hmm. No. No. I’m wrong there. It was 1945. Okay. June 1945. And the dam was already open? Yes. UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 15 Mm-hmm. It—it was already built and— Can you go back now to the early, to the thirties, and remember anything else about Boulder City that you haven’t told us? About the stores? Well, when we lived over in the Y, Mrs. Broder, she pitched one of those big army tents down here where the, what is it? The Coffee Cup Café used to—well, her tents sat there in that little V, and that was the first eating place in Boulder City. Mm-hmm. That is for the public. Anderson’s Mess Hall was where the workers ate. And that was also where they had the first Sunday school when we lived in the Y. They’d walk up there to the Anderson’s Mess Hall, and have their Sunday school. That was the adults, as much as there were children or (unintelligible)? No. That was children. Children. Because Mother Holland, she would take Fred Junior and take him, and they’d go over and walk up the railroad tracks to Anderson Mess Hall to Sunday school. Mm-hmm. And she took Hazel once or twice but Hazel was falling down and skinning her legs on the cinder (Laughs) so she didn’t take her. (Laughs) But—and then, they built the theatre and when we moved in the little house on Seventh Street, it was so hot, and we didn’t have coolers. We didn’t have refrigerators. And I had an orange crate on the kitchen window with a burlap sack over it, and we took a five gallon can and sit on top of UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 16 that with little tiny holes, with the water would drip down on that, and I kept milk, and lettuce, and carrots, and things in there. And— Where did you get your groceries, as a housewife? We had to go to Las Vegas. Mm-hmm. And Six Companies commissary was here, but their prices were clear out of reason. And Louie Foskerene, he’s an old-timer, he managed the Six Companies commissary. And that’s where I first knew him. But—and the post office, the first post office was out here. I think about where the Elks Club is. But we lived in the Y. We’d just walk over across the highway, and get the mail. And Mr. Finny was the first postmaster and his daughter, I can’t remember her name, she was Hazel’s schoolteacher. And Mrs. Foskerene, was Hazel’s schoolteacher and then, that went on years later, and Hazel was married. And she had three children and Patty went to the Paradise Valley School. And Mrs. Foskerene was her teacher out there. Well. (Laughs) And then, in two years, Steven went to school and she was his teacher out there. So it kind a stayed in the family. Yes. (Laughs) Well. Did you go to Las Vegas every day, for things like milk that wouldn’t—? Oh no. No. We went to the commissary for that. Oh. UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 17 And then, let’s see what—I guess by degrees, they built the other buildings. But the Manic Store was the first grocery store. And where was that? And that’s where Kay’s, well Kay’s corner is, and where the drugstore was. And then, the rest of that building was Manic’s Department Store. Mm-hmm. And they told me, or Fred said that, he saw Joe Manic’s at the dinner over here. I didn’t see him. Mm-hmm. I would like very much to have seen him. And his mother was with him. You’re speaking of the Thirty-Oner’s dinner? Yes. That they had just this year? Yes. In 19—? Uh-huh. Seventy six. And I would like very much to have seen Mrs. Manic’s. Mm-hmm. I have—course, I hadn’t seen her in years and years. So it was kind of rough. But it was the best we could do. There was work here. But so many, many people came and there was no work. It was pathetic. Oh. UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 18 And between here and Las Vegas, they would just drive off out in these washes in the gravel. And pitch their camps, and that summer of thirty-one had more of the hardest cloud bursts and flashfloods I ever saw in my life. Mm-hmm. I have never seen them since. So that kind of complicated things (Laughs) all the way around? Huh? Well, I say, that complicated things, for the construction— Oh yes. And for the people coming in. And these people, see, they come on, oh there was nice gravelly place, you know, and they’d pitch their camps. And I’d just cringe for ‘em. And when we lived in Las Vegas, Mr. Holland was driving back and forth, and I don’t know whether you’d know this, that you come out of town there’s that concrete bridge, out at—they used to call it Four Mile. It was four miles out of town. Mm-hmm. And it rained so hard that it washed both approaches. You couldn’t get on from either—either side. Mm-hmm. And they had to detour out around through the desert to get in. And one night they couldn’t get through and he spent the night sitting on the highway out there in a car. And our car had solid wheels. We had a little twenty-seven sedan, Chevy Sedan, and it had solid disk wheels, and he said, as the debris would wash in and back up against those wheels, he could feel that car, UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 19 moving sideways. And he would get out and the current was so swift, that he would, hold, run the window down and hold unto the car. And would kick that brush and stuff away from the wheels, so it would go on down. And it was said—I don’t know whether it was true or not. But it was said, that one man whose car was washed off of the highway and down through the wash and he—they didn’t recover him. Hm. But I don’t know whether that’s true or not. But I heard that. And it very well could have happened. Because they said that there were just cars and cars and cars sitting there—there all night. Well, when we came from Las Vegas out here, they still didn’t have the approaches back up to the bridge. And we had to detour and there was so much water running in that wash that they had a tractor there that they hooked the chain on and pulled us across the water onto the highway to come on out here. Mm-hmm. So. Well, we certainly, I— Appreciate your talking with us. (Laughs) And I’m sure that there’s lots of interesting things that you— Well. Probably omitted. But— I’m sorry that I had to backtrack in all this. Well, that’s alright. UNLV University Libraries Velma Holland 20 It’s kind of hard to— Mrs. Holland also mentioned that Claude Williams was the U. S. Marshall from whom they bought the tent house for twenty-five dollars. He was also the Marshall who asked them to move down to the Y when they moved up on the hill by the tank. When her children went to school over at the Y, they paid five dollars a child for the school. And when they went to the Boulder City School they also paid five dollars a child to M