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Transcript of interview with Pat Merl by Claytee White, October 9 & 28, 2008


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Patricia 'Pat' Merl plans for college did not materialized after graduation from a New Jersey high school in the late 1960s. Instead she took a receptionist job. The by the age of 19, it was her interest in dance classes that would lead her to audition to be a professional dancer for the Rockettes of Radio City Music Hall fame. Her days and weeks were filled with rigorous rehearsals and performances, but it was also an exciting time for a young and spirited girl. A side trip to Las Vegas in 1971 during her first ever vacation opened her to a new world of possibilities for a professional dancer. So without a job, she decides to remain in Las Vegas and explore the options. It became the beginning of a wide and varied career in the live entertainment industry. Pat's dancing resume includes working in many of the Las Vegas chorus lines of the 1970s, provides a flavor of what the work was like then and how it changed during the era. She includes the story of Frank Rosenthal and

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Merl, Pat Interview, 2008 October 9 & 28. OH-01285. [Transcript.] Oral History Research Center, Special Collections & Archives, University Libraries, University of Nevada, Las Vegas. Las Vegas, Nevada.


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An Interview with Patricia A. Merl An Oral History Conducted by Claytee D. White The Boyer Early Las Vegas Oral History Project Oral History Research Center at UNLV University Libraries University of Nevada Las Vegas ©The Boyer Early Las Vegas Oral History Project University of Nevada Las Vegas, 2007 Produced by: The Oral History Research Center at UNLV - University Libraries Director: Claytee D. White Editors: Barbara Tabach Transcribers: Kristin Hicks Interviewers and Project Assistants: Barbara Tabach and Claytee D. White The recorded interview and transcript have been made possible through the generosity of Dr. Harold Boyer. The Oral History Research Center enables students and staff to work together with community members to generate this selection of first-person narratives. The participants in this project thank the university for the support given that allowed an idea the opportunity to flourish. The transcript received minimal editing that includes the elimination of fragments, false starts, and repetitions in order to enhance the reader's understanding of the material. All measures have been taken to preserve the style and language of the narrator. In several cases photographic sources accompany the individual interviews. The following interview is part of a series of interviews conducted under the auspices of the Boyer Early Las Vegas Oral History Project. Claytee D. White, Project Director Director, Oral History Research Center University Libraries University Nevada, Las Vegas • • • 111 Interview with Pat Merl October 9 & 28, 2008 in Las Vegas, Nevada Conducted by Claytee D. White Table of Contents Pat Merl talks about being raised in New Jersey. She thought she would be a school teacher, but father explained he couldn't afford to send her to college. After graduation from high school she worked for a trucking firm as a receptionist. Also began to take dancing lessons where she learned about the Radio City Music Hall Rockettes, a dance troupe. Describes the process of auditions and the day she was selected to join the Rockettes, parents' reaction and her eventual move to New York. 1 She describes the complicated rehearsal and performance scheduling at Radio City Music Hall. After commuting became tiring, she moves into the city and lives at YWCA for a year, then an apartment with her friend Sharon. Cleared $125 a week for 28 shows. Co-workers developed a sense of family. Dancers ranged in age from 18 to 62. Talks about how 36 girls shared two dressing rooms divided by seniority, make up application, and strict punctuality rules. 8 Reminisces about costumes and favorite shows and musical numbers. Her parents didn't make it to many of her appearances, but were very proud of her. Loved listening to the live orchestra. First vacation (1971) she and friends take a Royal Caribbean Cruise. Afterwards, she visits relatives in California; cousin insists they take a trip to Las Vegas for a couple of days. 14 Talks about her brother, Karl, who is 8 years younger, and how her parents took in foster children. Her brother suffers a debilitating accident; changes in his life as a result. 17 Describes first trip to Las Vegas in 1971; stays at Landmark Hotel; saw Bobbie Gentry show. Describes differences between Radio City Music Hall and other dance productions. Mentions Folies Bergere and Jubilee, director Donn Arden. Distinguishes between "showgirls" and "dancers"; different roles, pay structure, etc. Learns she cannot audition while visiting Vegas, but meets performer Jillian Hrushowy and learns more. Makes decision to stay in Las Vegas. 19 With $300 and a credit card, rents a car and begins search for a place to live. First job is with Cashman Photography; photographer at Caesars Palace. Meanwhile, learns where auditions are. Joins a show in Tahoe. Describes how her audition attire, hair and makeup differs and contrasts from others in Las Vegas; this leads to jobs and a major change in her appearance to be an "Ashton girl." Value of being a new, "fresh face." 23 List lounge entertainers; who they worked behind and how she broke into the Las Vegas scene; details about "half-hour call" and being encouraged to hang around the audiences. Talks about camaraderie of Rockettes versus work culture of Vegas, audition process. Favorite Las Vegas show was Lido de Paris in 1978 and working with Donn Arden. 29 iv Becomes accustomed to being asked to be in a show, rather than audition. Tells story of auditioning for Donn Arden; staging and choreography for the show; story of going blank during a rehearsal, benefits of Rockettes training. Relates the story of Frank Rosenthal forcing Arden to apologize to cast. Describes changes that occurred for the show due to Rosenthal, including naming her co-company manager of Lido; personal interaction with Rosenthal. 34 Casino [the 1995 movie] mentioned and how she quit working for Frank Rosenthal and moved to Florida. Recaps the places she worked and lived after leaving Radio City Music Hall. Upon leaving Las Vegas, she moves to Miami Beach, Florida. Lands a dancing job with Minsky's Burlesque Show. Talks about working for Miller-Reash Productions as "show doctor" or company manager, off and on for about five years. 44 Life of traveling for her various jobs brings her back to Las Vegas in 1982 during a low economic time for the city. She bought a condo in Florida; then Leonard Miller hires her for his new venture with Royal Caribbean and Carnival Cruise Lines. Helps a friend fix a circus act which leads to a marketing director position with the Circus Vargas. Reluctantly returns again to Las Vegas with circus work and begins working on degree at UNLV during this time. 50 Discusses working for five years on the management team for a growing firm, Farrington Productions. In 2001, started teaching entertainment operations and production at UNLV Hotel College and taking a job at Wynn Hotel. Describes when black dancers began appearing in dance lines in 1979. 55 Concluding remarks. 57 List of Illustrations Following Page: Showgirl and dancing career photos 39 Appendix Courier News (Plainfield, NJ) article Radio City Music Hall correspondence Stardust Inter-Department Correspondences vi Preface Patricia 'Pat' Merl plans for college did not materialized after graduation from a New Jersey high school in the late 1960s. Instead she took a receptionist job. The by the age of 19, it was her interest in dance classes that would lead her to audition to be a professional dancer for the Rockettes of Radio City Music Hall fame. Her days and weeks were filled with rigorous rehearsals and performances, but it was also an exciting time for a young and spirited girl. A side trip to Las Vegas in 1971 during her first ever vacation opened her to a new world of possibilities for a professional dancer. So without a job, she decides to remain in Las Vegas and explore the options. It became the beginning of a wide and varied career in the live entertainment industry. Pat's dancing resume includes working in many of the Las Vegas chorus lines of the 1970s, provides a flavor of what the work was like then and how it changed during the era. She includes the story of Frank Rosenthal and how she quit to move to Florida. Florida opened new opportunities for Pat and she describes how she moved into management positions. Eventually, her career brought her back to las Vegas with the Farrington Productions firm. She now is the Director of Gaming Outreach for the International Gaming Institute. ORAL HISTORY RESEARCH CENTER AT UNLV UNLV Oral History Project @ Fifty Use Agreement Name of Narrator: Htr/^icuA A-Name of Interviewer: We, the above named, give tcVthe/Oral History Research Center of UNLV, the recorded interview(s) initiated on . as an unrestricted gift, to be used for such scholai ly and educational purppses as shall be determined, and transfer to the University of Nevada Las Vegas, legal title and all literary property rights including copyright. This gift does not preclude the right of the interviewer, as a representative of UNLV, to use the lecoi dings and i elated materials for scholarly pursuits, lhere will be no compensation for any interviews. Signature of Narrato1r1* TDVa, te I * x lgnature of Interviewer Library Special Collections 4505 Maryland Parkway, Box 457010, Las Vegas, Nevada 89154-7070 (702) 895-2222 This is Claytee White. It is October 9th, 2008. And I'm in the office of Pat Merl at UNLV in the IGI Center. So how are you today? I'm great, thank you. How are you? Fantastic. And could you please pronounce your name for me and spell your last name? My last name is Merl. And it's spelled M-E-R-L. And is your first name Pat or Patricia? My first name legally is Patricia. But I think it's too formal. So you use Pat? Pat. Okay, great. Well, Pat, could you tell me just a bit about your early childhood going back to New Jersey? Basically, my father's an emigrant. And he married my mother, found her in Union City, New Jersey after he got out of the military. Anyway, they got married and a year later they had me. My dad's goal was to get into the countryside—he loved open spaces and country—and we were living in a real urban environment, city buildings everywhere. So their goal in the first five or six years of their marriage was to save and find a home somewhere that was out of the city. And they did. While they did that I stayed with my grandmother. And they achieved their goal and we ended up moving into the suburbs of New Jersey. People think New Jersey is a dump and it really isn't. They don't call it "The Garden State" for nothing. There are some beautiful, beautiful small towns there add I feel very fortunate to have lived in what ended up being still a magnificent town now. And, actually, it's the home to most of the Wall Street stockbrokers. What is the name of it? It's called Westfield, New Jersey. And it has one of the most coveted communities called Wychwood Gardens, which is like one or two in the United States as far as choices of places to live for wealthy people. So we kind of slipped in under the wire. I don't know how that happened. My dad worked for the Department of Public Works in Westfield and used to commute from Union City to Westfield. And then we moved closer to his work and we got into Cranford and 1 lived there. And then in my senior year of high school my dad bought our last house in New Jersey and it was in the town of Westfield. So I was fortunate enough to live there for one year before I embarked on what ended up being a major career move in my life. My dad is old country. And as a result I didn't get an opportunity to get the kind of schooling that I had hoped to get. I went to a wonderful private school when I was younger—they worked very, very hard to put me through that private school—and then I went to a public high school. I always wanted to be a teacher. That was the thing that I wanted to do. I used to pretend to be a teacher in my backyard with one big gigantic piece of slate blackboard that my father found in the town dump and put it up for me. And I used to teach my imaginary students outside for hours and hours on end for quite a few years. While I was going through high school I kind of assumed that I would go to college. We never really discussed it. And then one day I went home and started to talk to my dad about it and he said, "Patty, I can't put you through school." He says, "And besides that you're probably going to marry and have children and I only have enough money and actually I don't have enough money for that, and that's to make sure your brother has the opportunity for an education." I love my father. And I will never ever resent that decision. I respected it, but I was terribly disappointed. And had I known then what I know now, I would have been able to go to school. Then I was kind of pushed by the guidance counselors to go out of the college preparatory track and to move into the business track so that I could earn a good living if I decided to go out and work professionally. So as a result of that I decided that I would just move forward on faith. I always trusted my parents. I moved forward on faith and I graduated from high school and went out and got myself my first job, which was as a receptionist for a trucking firm down at Elizabethport, New Jersey, one of the big shopping companies, distribution companies, and worked my way -- funny enough, I'm the kind of person ~ I'm very inquisitive and I was always asking people what they were doing, why they were doing it and how they did it. And I went from receptionist to an assistant dispatcher for this trucking firm. And I moved from there into the accounting position and ended up doing some of the accounting for the firm and started to really enjoy myself. I thought it was a lot of fun. 2 But while I was doing that, to keep fit I took dance classes. That was my mom's idea. There was a little studio in our small town. And she said why don't we go there? And she loved my costumes. And I remember buying costumes and doing recitals. So it was a hobby and it was something I really loved. I also was fortunate to have music in my background. My dad played accordion and organ. He taught me and we used to play together. So there was a lot of art and performance art in my background. And I don't know—I had been going to this dance studio for years. For some reason one night after work I used to go three nights a week—I noticed on the wall photos that were always there and I just looked at them and said how nice and went on about my dance classes. Then one night I looked at the photos on the wall and I asked my dance professor who are these women? And she said, oh, those are my Radio City Music Hall Rockettes that I teach. I had been going for years and never even saw this. So I said really? And she told me a little bit about each one of them. There were three of them. And something happened where it sparked my interest. So a couple of weeks later I went in and just asked, Do you think I might be able to do something like this? And she said, well, you'll have to work a little harder than you are. You'll have to come all the time because there are certain skills that you'll need to do to know how to do; dance skills and abilities that you'll need to have in order to move into something like this or even consider auditioning for something like this. So I said okay and I started coming. And the things we worked on—the dance was there. To audition for Radio City you had to have some ballet background, strong ballet foundation, jazz and, of course, tap. That was the main dance form that they used. And did you know any of those already? Oh, yeah. I had been studying for years off and on. As I got older I started paying for my own. And that was one of the reasons why I started going so much more often. That was another thing that my dance teacher afforded me an opportunity that I don't know if anyone else got there. I said to her I don't know if I can afford to come many more times than I'm coming. And she said I think we can work something out for you. So I guess she saw maybe there was a chance for me. We worked out a deal where I could take as many dance classes as I 3 wanted for a certain fee per week. It was very reasonable. And, of course, she had to kick me out of the dance studio every night so she could close. Oh, isn't that wonderful? Yeah. I still think of her. I love her. I want us to go back and I want you to give me your parents' names and your brother's name and the age difference in you and your brother. Okay. And there is something else that I will bring into that, too. My father's name is Charles William Merl. He just recently passed away, too. So that's a little wall, which I thought I'd get around. And we never get over it. Yeah. And my mom, her name is Anna Marie Merl. And thank God she's still with me. She's a vibrant, dynamic 81-year-old. I'm going to move her to Florida from North Carolina next week. We just sold the house in North Carolina. So I know I'm all over the place. But that's that. And my brother Karl, his name is Karl Peter Merl. And he is 52 years old. And he was the one that we were going to get going through college. He was a very close friend, my brother Karl. He was my buddy, but we didn't spend a lot of time together. A lot of things happened while I was away eventually in my career that changed a lot of that anyway. So it's funny how the best-laid plans of mice and men you never really know. That's right. Where did Karl go to college? He never went. You have to tell that story. Yeah. There's a lot. And my father spent the last 20 years of his life apologizing to me. But I thanked him because I wouldn't trade my life for anything. I'm very, very happy with my life. That's wonderful. Good. Where was I? The dance studio. So I'm touched because my teacher—without her I wouldn't be where I am. She helped build my life for me. So I took some classes. It was about eight months. And the way to get an audition at Radio City at that time was to write a letter requesting that you be notified the next time they have a major audition. And this is a long time ago. This is 1968. So I was at the trucking firm for a little bit over a year. Funny, I look back at the way I 4 thought or didn't think about what was about to happen. I got the letter from Radio City saying that there was an audition in August and I was invited to come. And I remember it was 10:30 in the morning. The letter, first of all, they spelled my name wrong, M-E-R-E, which a lot of people do. And, secondly, the letter said unless you're absolutely sure you have all the qualifications required to be a Radio City Music Hall Rockette, please don't waste your time or money coming to the audition. Well, tell that to any 16-, 17- or 18-year-old girl and I don't think they're going to see that part. They're just going to show up. So I decided I was going to go. My dance teacher said she would come with me. Funny enough, Radio City Music Hall—well, New York City and Radio City were exactly 45 minutes by bus from where our house was in Westfield, New Jersey. I find that funny because it reminds me of that song "45 Minutes from Broadway" by George M. Cohan. And so I would think of that song when I would go in on the bus. So I went often to New York City, took some master classes every now and then. But it was the time when young women didn't travel around that much. It sounds ancient, but it's not. My dance teacher felt an obligation to go with me. So I took the bus in with her. And the day before the audition actually, it wasn't. I did give them a reasonable amount of time and I can't tell you how much, but it wasn't many days because it was a quick turnaround. I told my bosses at the trucking firm, I said, I won't be in on whatever day that was because I'm going to audition for Radio City Music Hall. I didn't ask them. I just kind of let them know. And I didn't imagine that they wouldn't want to let me go. So they kind of smiled and said, okay, well, we wish you a lot of luck. And so what's the deal? Well, I'll audition. If I get the job, I'll let you know. I'll be back. Okay. So I go. And I go on the bus with my dance teacher. And we get there and I go upstairs to the audition hall. There is a gigantic audition hall with several hundred young women and we began the audition process. At that time you had to do a combination in tap and ballet and in jazz and, of course, you had to do the trademark kicks, many types of kicks. And you had to know them all, spring kicks and flip kicks and ground kicks and inward fan kicks an outward fan kicks and scissor kicks, just all kinds of ways of kicking. And they had to be certain heights. A very disciplined troupe. If they said eye-high, you had to do it eye-high and you had to do eight of 5 them eye-high. And they couldn't be nose-high or mouth-high. Everything had to be exactly precise. There were so many girls there the audition lasted—it was probably about four hours. And I was just so wired for the whole thing. And when my name came up and it was time for me, I did my thing. I had watched at least 50 girls go by with just barely being able to do a step or two before they said thank you very much. They were very stringent with height requirements. And you had to be a minimum of five-foot-seven and a quarter. And I remember I was five-foot-seven and a quarter when I went to Radio City. I'm five-eight and a half now. I don't know what happened. But I think I'm going back to five-seven and a quarter. So I just made it. I passed that part of the requirements. A lot of girls were dropped just in the measurement process. And then as they began to dance they were dropped for the way they danced, the way they didn't dance, the way they looked as they danced, all those things. And you never really knew. Sometimes you knew some of the reasons why. Other reasons were not evident. But I do remember girls flying from all over the country. At that time it wasn't international, but girls flying from everywhere, all over the country, and a lot of tears even when it wasn't your turn and how moving it was. So I did mine and I was told thank you and sit down. So that was good. And the audition after four hours, the director of—well, the founder of Radio City was still there, of the Radio City Music Hall Rockettes. He was still directing the company, the line. And his assistant choreographer was there. And the founder at that point was probably in his late 60s. And the assistant choreographer, she was probably in her middle 50s. So it was the passing of an era that I was starting to watch and I got to witness. All of a sudden they said, okay, we'll be right back and they got up and left the room. And it was a big gigantic room. When they slammed the door, you heard this loud echo. And I looked around the room and there were two people, myself and another girl who happens to be my very close friend to this day. And I said, okay, I don't know what this means. What is her name? Her name is Sharon Jones. Her maiden name was Sharon Echols. We got in the same little changing room together prior to the audition and said a couple of words to each other about how 6 nervous we were. So we're sitting there. After about two minutes Sharon said to me did we get it? And I said I don t know, but I'm afraid to move. Are we supposed to stay here? And she said I don t know. But she stayed on her side of the room and I stayed on mine. And we sat there. And after what seemed like an eternity—it probably was 15 minutes—he came back and said, well, go get something to eat because you're going to start rehearsal in about two hours. Be back at two o clock. And he slammed the door and walked away again. So I went downstairs in the elevator with Sharon. And I couldn't bring myself to get out of the elevator because I knew I was going to see my dance teacher. And I was so emotional it was like I can t go see her now. I just need to not talk to anybody. I need a minute to absorb all this. So my friend gets out of the elevator and I hear my dance teacher say how many more people are up there? And she said, well, just one more. She's in the elevator. And she said Pat? And I stepped out of the elevator and I started crying hysterically. And I hugged her. She said it's okay, you can come back and we can do it again. And I said I got it, I got it. So she started crying too and so did my friend Sharon because this was the most exciting day of our lives. It's something she had hoped to do her whole life. This is something I never expected to be able to do. So we went to have lunch and then back to rehearse. I opened two weeks later in the Hawaiian-themed show, and spent the next three years at Radio City learning a lot about dance and little did I know how much about life and people. Oh, there are so many things. Before you continue you mentioned that sometimes you would go into New York for a master class. What is that? Oh, that's a class that's taught by absolute quintessential dance masters and professionals. These are high-level classes. There are usually whole caravans of people that go in and take these classes. They're high-priced, but you're going to learn from the top people in the industry in that field. How did your parents feel about you auditioning for Radio City Music Hall? They didn't know. I felt it was okay if I didn't say anything. I was almost 19 years old. And I figured that I could take a day off from work and go into New York with my dance teacher and audition. Were you still living at home? 7 Yes. When we got out I called my mother immediately. I was on the phone right after I finished crying with my dance teacher. And I called, "Mom, mom." And I couldn't get it out and I couldn't get it out. And she s like what happened? Trish, what happened? What happened? I got it, I got it, I got it. What did you get? Oh, mom, I'm at Radio City Music—and I told her the whole thing. There was like this dead silence. And I said I really don't have a lot of time to talk. I'm going to go to lunch and I m going to come back for rehearsal and he said we'll be finished at ten o'clock. I m going to take the bus home. Can you pick me up at 11:30 tonight at the bus stop? And my mom said okay and she hung up the phone. And I didn't see them until 11:30 that night. And I didn t think to ask them if it was all right. I just was on my way in my life. It just happened at that point. Oh, that's fantastic. I want to know all there is to know about Radio City Music Hall. And the reason is I have another group of dancers that I interviewed a couple of years ago and one of them danced at Radio City Music Hall. And right now all I can think of is Margaret. I don't remember Margaret's last name. But I have a picture of her on top of the building. Oh, wow. Well, she must be older than I am then. She is. She's much older. There are a lot of Rockettes that live in town that were in the troupe when I was in the troupe. So what would you like to know? I want to know if you moved from home to New York. I want to know a typical day in the life of a Rockette. I'd like to know how you changed the scenes during the year. Okay. The thing about Radio City was that once you went to Radio City there was nothing else in your life. Now when I look back on it, I parallel it to being in the military in many, many, many ways. I still draw upon experiences from that and I see how that made me strong in so many ways and how vital and valuable that experience was. That was a result of learning how to be around and live with and work with so many different kinds of people; how to prioritize your life to where what's most important to you; to never lose focus; to discipline yourself to do all the things that you need to do in order to succeed. It also taught me a lot about myself. And there are some good things and some bad things. That's why I say it's like the military. In those days, you had a tremendous amount of respect, obviously, for anyone who was 8 your senior much less someone of such fame and notoriety as the director. You were disciplined to where when he walked in the room he didn't have to tell everyone to get quiet and get ready. Everybody just immediately shut up and walked up there and got in line and was ready to go. We were also disciplined in the way we dressed and the way we wore our hair. We were disciplined in our timing and when to be at work and when we could leave and what we could do. At Radio City if you went on vacation, you weren't allowed to ski or do anything that might cause injury. And that was your agreement that you would take care of your health and your well-being so that you were able to function and perform in your position. We weren't allowed to get suntanned, no tan lines, nothing that would differentiate you from the girl next to you. The goal was that everybody was to be one and the same. And I can verify that I did that very well because my parents used to say where were you? How can we find you? I'm 18th from the right or I'm the one in the and so you would describe these different things. So the first thing about Radio City that I remember was having to get up very early in the morning for rehearsals. Oh, you asked me about my transportation and my moving and those kinds of things. For the first three months I continued living at home with my family. There was not even a discussion about me moving into New York. So it involved me getting up at about seven in the morning and taking the eight o'clock bus that would get me into New York City about nine. And then I would walk to Radio City Music Hall, which is about ten blocks from Port Authority, and I would be there ~ because you'd have to be there by half hour. That's the golden time for all the performers to be in. A half-hour before performance you must be there. A lot of people didn't understand why people had to do that. I used to be there about an hour and a half before to warm up, put my makeup on and preset my costumes. But half-hour was in case something unforeseen happened in the show. If somebody was out and adjustments had to be made, you were available for the line captain, which was the person who told you what you were going to do that show, and who would be able to tell you what you needed to do to make those adjustments. I did that for about three months. And I got home just a little bit before midnight, 11:45. My mom picked me up at the bus at 11:30. I'd get home about 11:45. And we worked seven days a week. So you worked seven days a week for three weeks or four weeks, sometimes five weeks. You never really knew. They would put the days off once a month and you would never know 9 whether you were working three weeks, four weeks or five weeks until that schedule went up. You would get four days off each one of those three-week or four-week periods. And the rest of the days of that week you were on-call and you would have to come in if they needed you to come in for any reason. You never would think of calling in sick. You never would think of calling in hurt. The demand for that job was so tremendous that they would constantly remind you that there were thousands of people waiting at the door for your position. So there was not a lot of room for you to do anything unfavorable. So after about three months I got to where I was so exhausted; I said I don't know if I can make it anymore. And my girlfriend Sharon was coming in from Long Island and she would take the train in and out. And my parents were concerned because I'm walking to Port Authority at 11.00 at night, not safe. New York was very unsafe at that time. So I talked to my parents. And we ended up, my girlfriend Sharon and I, getting a one-bedroom — actually, a room at the YWCA. That was the way my parents let us leave. And we stayed at the YWCA for about a year. And then we finally made our transition into our apartment. And, again, we didn't live too far away. We lived on 45th Street between Eighth and Ninth Avenue and Radio City was on 51st Street on Eighth Avenue, just long enough for us to walk that. We'd walk that every day to and fro. So rehearsals at Radio City, would depend on the length of the show. Again, sometimes we'd do two two-weekers if it worked out that's what needed to be done. I don't know how those determinations were made, but they always came around the holidays in November and December. And I think it's because the holiday shows ran longer, uncharacteristically longer than other shows and by demand. I do know that's how they were scheduled. So I think those two-weekers fell in there based on box office receipts now that I look back. Did you do more than one performance per day? Oh, yeah. We did 28 shows per week, four shows a day, seven days a week. That's under the normal schedule. Christmas and Easter we did five shows a day, seven days a week. So that's why I said you had to be ready to dedicate your life because between those shows, one break, my girlfriend and I would walk home. We'd do our laundry. We'd clean the house. One break always every day you would take a dance class of some sort. A lot of people think once you get a professional job you