Transcript of interview with Frank Cope by Marianne Johnson, March 15, 1978

UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope i An Interview with Frank Cope An Oral History Conducted by Marianne Johnson Ralph Roske Oral History Project on Early Las Vegas Special Collections and Archives Oral History Research Center University Libraries University of Nevada, Las Vegas UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope ii © Ralph Roske Oral History Project on Early Las Vegas University of Nevada, Las Vegas, 2017 UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope iii The Oral History Research Center (OHRC) was formally established by the Board of Regents of the University of Nevada System in September 2003 as an entity of the UNLV University Libraries’ Special Collections Division. The OHRC conducts oral interviews with individuals who are selected for their ability to provide first-hand observations on a variety of historical topics in Las Vegas and Southern Nevada. The OHRC is also home to legacy oral history interviews conducted prior to its establishment including many conducted by UNLV History Professor Ralph Roske and his students. This legacy interview transcript received minimal editing, such as the elimination of fragments, false starts, and repetitions in order to enhance the reader's understanding of the material. All measures have been taken to preserve the style and language of the narrator. The interviewee/narrator was not involved in the editing process. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope iv Abstract On March 15, 1978, Marianne Johnson interviewed Frank Cope (born in Kansas, in 1930) at his home in Las Vegas, Nevada. Frank’s family relocated to Nevada from Kansas when he was six months old. For school, he attended the Westside Grammar School, Las Vegas Grammar School on Fifth Street, and Las Vegas High School. He also attended Carson City High School for two years before enlisting in the Army and going overseas. Pertaining to work, Mr. Cope describes his occupation as distribution superintendent at the Las Vegas Valley Water District. He recalls how he met his wife, who also works for the water district as a secretary in the engineering department. Additionally, most of Frank’s brothers work for the water district as well. Social groups or organizations Frank mentions being affiliated with include the Las Vegas Golf Association, two motorcycle clubs, the American Public Works Association, the American Water Works Association, and the Las Vegas Elks Lodge 1468. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 1 Narrator, Frank Cope. Day, March 15th, 1978. Time, 4:00 P.M. Place, 5934 Sheila Avenue, Las Vegas, Nevada. Interviewer, Marianne Johnson. Address, 4531 Lorna Place. Project, Local History Project Oral Interview, Life of a Las Vegas Old-timer. ‘Kay, Frank, where do you work? I work at Las Vegas Valley Water District. Oh and what is your occupation? What do you do, at the water company? I’m a distribution superintendent. And what does that—? Mean? (Laughs) Well, the district, start off small, when the railroad owned it, and now it’s growing to the point that there are many divisions and departments. And in my particular department, which is maintenance and operations, I have the maintenance end of it. I’m superintendent of distribution. Oh. I see. Which is maintenance of the system and installation of new water lines. Mm-hm. ‘Kay. What part of Las Vegas do you live in? Ah, you would call it the northwestern corner of Las Vegas. Mm-hmm, and didn’t you just move a couple of years ago? Yes. We lived down on West Sahara and then we moved to, just a different area, a quieter area. Uh-huh. What’s your house like now? Is it bigger or smaller, or? It’s larger, and we like to think nicer. We’re happier here than the other place, just a change. Mm-hm. Are you married? Yes. How long have you been married? UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 2 Fifteen years, the fifth of next month. Oh, how nice. What’s your wife’s name? Jerry-Lynn Cope. And what’s she like? Perfect. (Laughs) Perfect. (Laughs) (Laughs) Or near perfect, anyway. Okay. Her choice of me should prove that. Yes. (Laughs) Where does she work? She works at the Las Vegas Valley Water District, also. Oh. But she’s a secretary in the engineering department. Oh, I see. And are your parents living, right now? My mother is, not my dad. Mm-hm. My mother lives—she’s retired and lives in Blue Diamond with some of my brothers. Oh. How many brothers do you have? I have five brothers and five sisters. Wow. All alive. And all but one in Las Vegas and Blue Diamond. Big family then, huh? Yes. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 3 Where do they work? Scattered around? They’re scattered around. Three of my brothers work with me at the water district. Mm-hm. Only one or two of them work directly under me, under my foreman. The rest are on different departments. Oh, I see. What are they like and, well, from the oldest to the youngest, why don’t you just tell us a little about, if they’re married or what they’re like? Okay. Well, as far as the girls go, from the oldest down, the oldest is still living with my mother, always has, never has married, has stayed with her and she’s in Blue Diamond with my mother. The rest of the other four girls on down the line are all married, couple of them had been married. They’re on their second marriage. One’s single now. They all have children. They’re all reasonably happy, I presume. And the boys, I’m the oldest boy, and you’ve got my history. The others, going down the line, are all married, with the exception of one. One of them lives in Carson City, with his wife and a new baby. The others are all here with families, jobs, and apparently happy. I think everybody’s pretty happy. Mm. Mm-hm. What is your ethnic ancestry? Hm. (Laughs) I’m not sure. (Laughs) Ah, I think German, Indian, Irish and Swede. Awe. A little bit of everything. Yes. Duke’s mixture. (Laughs) Where were you born? I was born in Kansas, in 1930. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 4 And how long did you live there? About six months. I came to Las Vegas when I was about six months old. So you don’t remember too much of Kansas, right? Nothing. (Laughs) I don’t remember much of Vegas till I got three, five, or six. (Laughs) (Laughs) Fine. Okay. Ah, so you only lived in Kansas and Las Vegas then, right? That’s it, yes. And I was in the Army for a short period of time. Uh-huh. Well, what can you remember about Las Vegas, you know, when you were younger and how—how has it built up? Well, it’s almost indescribable. Las Vegas, I can remember Fremont Street only having wooden sidewalks on part of it, the rest of it was dirt. Oh. Stop signs, no lights. Downtown Fremont, the way I remember it, ended at approximately Fifth or Sixth Street. It didn’t go much further. It wasn’t—I can’t remember any curbs, gutters, or sidewalks in that area. No cruisers? (Laughs) No cruisers. No high rises. The Strip was very small when I was a teenager. In fact, it seemed like the rodeos were out. When I was a kid, we used to take a day, hike to get out to the rodeos, Helldorado rodeos on the Strip. The, I think the El Rancho or The Last Frontier, one of those places had the shoots and all out there. But that was—that was miles out of town. There’s nothing but desert between town and there. Mm-hm. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 5 And it’s, the Westside was—we lived on the west side of the tracks. It was called, Westside, in Las Vegas. That’s the way we’ve described it. You lived on Westside or you lived uptown. And we had to walk from Westside, across the tracks to school on South Fifth Street, which is now, I believe, the state building, Annex. And there was only the Grammar School and the high school, those two only. Now there’s high schools and junior highs all over Las Vegas. And I don’t remember the population. But it has grown, it’s not the same city. It’d be like going from here to uh, possibly like Blue Diamond. That’s the way I remember it, it’s so small. Yes. And you knew everybody in town. Uh-huh. Everybody knew everybody. Yes. It has grown a lot. You said that your mother was, or your mother lives in Blue Diamond. Did you ever live in Blue Diamond, at all? No. I’ve never lived in Blue Diamond. When you moved to Las Vegas, where did you first move to, the Westside of town? No. When we first moved to Las Vegas, it wasn’t Las Vegas, proper. We first of all lived in Boulder City, prior to the dam being built now, I was too young to remember any of it. But we lived in what they called Ragtown, which was located where Lake Mead is now. Mm. Once they built the dam, then the water backed up and so there’s no more Ragtown. My dad worked on the dam, and we moved to Las Vegas probably when I was about, oh, four years old or something like five, so, I don’t remember any of that. Yes. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 6 But my mother’s told me where we lived. Uh-huh. Do you remember anything about the dam being built? Only that my dad worked on it. Uh-huh. And he, you know, I was a young kid and he’d go to work and come back and tell me about what he was doing. Yes. You didn’t really get to see it, though? No. Before that? I didn’t go out there. Oh, okay. Nobody had cars in those days. (Laughs) That’s true. Too far to walk. Well, didn’t you have a horse and carriage? (Laughs) (Laughs) That was before horses. (Laughs) Oh, I see. Ah, what schools did you attend? Ah, Westside Grammar School, I attended Las Vegas Grammar School, from the, when you left the Third grade, in those days, you went to the fourth grade was uptown. That was Las Vegas Grammar School on Fifth Street, and then Las Vegas High School. Mm-hm. And then I went to Carson City for two years and attended Carson City High School, and I didn’t complete it. I quit high school and went into the Army and went overseas. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 7 Oh, what part of overseas did you go, to? I went to Korea, Japan, Okinawa, and the Philippines. Did you ever fight in any battles? No. I was too well liked. Oh. (Laughs) I think I started them. (Laughs) (Laughs) Could be. Ah, where have you traveled throughout your life? Well, other than when I was in the Army, my only travels have been in the United States, and that’s hunting through Utah, Arizona, Montana, Idaho, Wyoming, Oregon, and Washington. This is all in the pursuit of hunting and fishing. Mm-hm. Isn’t hunting and fishing one of your biggest hobbies? Well, it was when I was younger. Now it’s golf and motorcycles. (Laughs) But from the looks of your game room, it looks like, ah, you’ve caught a quite a few. Yes. I’ve had good luck. A lot of fun. Each one has a big story behind it. Uh-huh. And I had a good guide. Oh really? (Laughs) Anything spectacular ever happen on one of your hunting trips that you could tell about? (Laughs) (Laughs) No. They were all just real good fun hunting trips. Uh-huh. Successful. Uh-huh. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 8 Enjoyable. Expensive. Yes. Tell us a little bit about your jobs that you’ve had while you’ve been living in Las Vegas, other than the water company. Well, the only jobs I’ve had really, other than the one I, I’ve been with the water company now for twenty-nine years. So, it doesn’t leave much time for other jobs. I worked as a shill in a Downtown casino for about four or five months, one time, in between jobs. And I worked, a few part-time jobs I worked a tobacco local wholesaler for two years, as a delivery boy, and a warehouseman. And the rest of my working life has been with the water district. Well, then you must know an awful lot about the water district, right? (Laughs) Well. I think I do. But— Well. What were the water systems like when you first moved here and started working at the water company? Well. When I first started working at the water company, the system was very small. Number one it was owned by, the Union Pacific Railroad, so, we worked, in fact, for the railroad. Uh-huh. The town was small so the system was small. They still had redwood water mains, led service lines in effect. We were just in the process of phasing them out at that time, too. Cast iron and galvanized service lines. Which we are now phasing out for asbestos, cement pipe, and copper lines, and the copper is now being phased out by the more sophisticated plastics. Mm-hm. When I went to work there, the boss, myself, and three others, we only had a crew of five. And now I think the water district employs about 225. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 9 Yes. So know must—well, in fact you must know about everybody who has worked with the water company, right? Just about. Uh-huh. Yes. (Laughs) Yes. Head honcho. You don’t get to know those, all of those in the office too well. No. But all of them that’s been in the field, I’ve known. Uh-huh. And I’ve went through, I believe about six general managers. Wasn’t there a water hole called the Meadows, or something like that, a long time ago? I water hole called the Meadows? I’m not sure if it’s a water hole or—do you remember Meadows, something called the Meadows? Well, yes, there still are parts of town that’s called the Meadows down off of east Charleston. Yes. And the Boulder Highway. On the west, the springs in general, the water, if we’re talking about the water, was primarily on the west side of town, and flowed into the, what they called Las Vegas Creek. And then went from west to east down through town to the Old Mormon Fort. Mm-hm. Where they had, eventually had a swimming pool, but they had stock and they raised crops and whatnot down there. But that, the springs were flowing then, and they flowed right through the UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 10 entire town, down to that end of town, eventually out to approximately Nellis now. Where it just, they had green fields out there, just from the water flowing down there. Ah, you’re not Mormon, are you? No ma’am. Well, were you one of the first settlers, I guess, was your family one of the first families who came to Las Vegas, who wasn’t—that wasn’t Mormon? Well, maybe one of the first, but there was, ah, there was quite a few people in Vegas, when we got here, that I can remember anyway. Uh-huh. You know, I was rather young when we came here but there were other families here. There’s a lot of them old-timers and—no, we were, we’ve been here a long time and there was—it’s nothing like it is now. But we were among the first, but not the really early pioneers. Mm-hm. Well, they didn’t, there weren’t any problems being, between the Mormon people and the people who weren’t Mormon, were there? No. No, in fact, I don’t recall any problems between anybody. Uh-huh. In those days, everybody knew everybody and everybody was friends. Just was a peaceful western town, then? Beautiful. Absolutely perfect. Uh-huh. ‘Course I was looking at it through a kids eyes, too. Yes. That’s true. Ah, what are your hobbies right now, besides hunting? Hunting, well, that’s kinda third on the list. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 11 Yes. Right now, it’s golfing and desert motorcycles. Are you a good golfer? No. (Laughs) I’m rotten. (Laughs) But don’t you spend an awful lot of time on the golf course? My wife says so, yes. (Laughs) Does she golf with you? Yes. Uh-huh. She does. Well, that’s good, and, ah, you ride motorcycles? Yes, and my wife had her own motorcycle for a while till she got hurt and then she quit riding ‘em. Oh. Well, she was smart. (Laughs) You haven’t learned yet, right? I don’t think so. (Laughs) Have you had any serious accidents? Not serious enough to make me quit. No. No? No. I’ve never been hurt seriously. Dirty and scratched up but not serious. Mm-hm. Have you won anything, any big trophies or anything? No. Peace of mind and contentment, that’s all. (Laughs) the fun, right? Just fun. The excitement. Large bills. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 12 Yes. (Laughs) That you have to pay. Yes. Do you belong to any special organizations? Just the Las Vegas Golf Association and two motorcycle clubs. Uh-huh. I belong to the American Public Works Association. I’m a member through the district and the American Water Works Association. These are national associations. And I belong to Elks, Las Vegas Elks Lodge 1468. Mm-hm. Me and my friend Niles joined together. Niles? That sounds Swedish. (Laughs) He is. They call him, Yogi. Oh. (Laughs) Okay. Well, could you tell us a little bit about the Elks organization, and how it began? I don’t really know how it began. I haven’t been a member long enough. It takes—there’s so much to the Elks. Their background goes back so far. Most people know what they are. They’re an organization that, it seems to me, all they do is help charities and help the needy. Mm-hm. That, they get together, and have fun and through this having fun they raise money and with this money they fund people: charity organizations, events, they help crippled people, blind people, hard of hearing people, handicap, unfortunates. Mm-hm. Ah, it just seems like they’re always giving. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 13 Yes. Ah, do you know how long they’ve been an organization? I really don’t know. I should but I don’t. A long time? A long time, yes. And the numbers, do you know what they stand for? I believe the Lodge 1468 is the number designated to that lodge. Oh, it’s just--? That’s just the number of that Las Vegas lodge. That particular lodge. Oh, I see. I know you haven’t lived in Blue Diamond but you have, your mother lives there and some of your brothers live there. Do you know how much it’s changed since like, say, when you first moved to Las Vegas? Well, not when I first moved to Vegas but when I was a teenager, and actually teenagers run around. And so, I had occasion to visit Blue Diamond, go through there, on several occasions, and the way I remember it—it was pretty much a mining town for the Blue Diamond Mill. Only the people that worked there lived there, and it was—I believe it was developed and built especially for those people. And now there’s probably as many people living there that work in Vegas, that work at the mine. Uh-huh. Including my brothers and other friends. So the mine is still—? The mine is still operating. Still operating. Yes. Probably bigger now than it was then, and probably more important. UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 14 Well, what is it that they mine out there? Ah, I believe it’s called gypsum, they manufacture plasterboard to build houses with. Oh, oh, I see. So then Blue Diamond must be developing as the years go by. I think it’s developed as much as the town. Uh-huh. Comparatively speaking. I see. Do you have any pets? Yes. (Laughs) we have two dogs. (Laughs) What kind are they? Well, one’s a little white Miniature Poodle and the other one’s a black Great Dane. Oh. (Laughs) Perfect for each other, right? What are their names? The Poodle is Darlin’ and the Great Dane is Farrah. Awe, that’s very sweet. (Laughs) My wife named ‘em both. That was nice. Ah, are there any problems with the whole family working together, at the water company? I don’t think so. I don’t know of any, the way I look at it, we get, sometimes, we’re subjected to criticism, and accused of nepotism. But people fail to realize that when my brothers went to work for the Water Company, was because help was hard find—steady help. Mm-hm. And I didn’t hire any of ‘em. They were hired by my boss, because they were steady and they have been on the job for years and years and years. Oh. Well, how long, have they all been working there about as long as you have? UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 15 No. Not as long as me. One of ‘em has been there, I think, twenty-three years. One of ‘em about eighteen and one probably sixteen or seventeen. Mm-hm. My wife has been there, I think, fifteen years or sixteen. I met her there. You met her there? She was working there when I met her. Uh-huh. Oh, I see. I know that after this interview you have to go teach a class. Would you like to tell us a little bit about that? What it is that you teach? Well, I’m presently taking a class for certification in water distribution, which that’s my field. And there’s no certification program in the state of Nevada that’s required. Mm-hm. It’s not mandatory. I have just chosen to take this class to certify myself and I’m presently taking this class so I can get, obtain the grade four certification. And me instructing this class is just a hit-and-miss thing. Not every night—off and on. Because I’m attempting to learn my instructor’s methods and develop my own. Because I anticipate when he moves on to teach a higher class, a grade three, then I want to instruct this grade one class. Oh, I see, and is it—are you planning on going for a higher position at the water company, or just getting this? Not—not really. I don’t really want a higher position. I just want the certification, and I want to instruct, because it’s interesting and it is my field. I feel more comfortable where I’m at because I know what I’m doing. As long as I’m where I’m at, I can do a good job for myself and the company and I don’t think I’m prepared to go any higher. Oh, so you don’t have any big plans for the future? UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 16 No big plans right now. Well, that’s good. Maybe president of the United States, but— (Laughs) Well, that, you know, comes with time. You don’t have to rush into those things. ‘Kay, I know that you moved here when you were, when you were just a baby, and you grew up here. What are some of the things that you can remember while you were growing up? Some specific things? Well, it would be easier if you could ask me about something specific and jar my memory. Oh, like, ah, did you know anything about the Old Ranch? I can remember the Old Ranch, as a, I recall it as a, kind of the local swimming pool. We used to go out to the Old Ranch to swim. And they had little, I remember like, kind of like a candy store there, and the swimming pool was fenced. And I went to school with some children that lived there, their parents and them lived there. I can’t recall their name now. One of the girls was a real pretty blonde, I remember that. (Laughs) And then they had the old mermaid swimming pool, which was on Fifth Street, which is now Las Vegas Boulevard, just north of Fremont a half a block. And it was a public swimming pool. We used to march down from Grammar School to go, during physical education class, we’d go swimming. And that was the, like Municipal pool, or public pool. And there was a couple of ponds around Vegas that people owned that were cemented. Was better than the mud holes we swam in, naturally, like I said, the Las Vegas Creek ran through Las Vegas, and it was all artesian water; fresh and clean. And there was hundreds of swimming pools there that everybody could go swimming any place on the creek. On the Westside, what is now called Westside, and I UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 17 can’t tell you exactly where it was—it would be approximately, oh, in the area of Vegas Drive and I Street, was what we called then, the Old Updike Dairy. And there was a—just a dirt landing strip. I remember they had an old bi-wing airplane out there that carried mail. And this fella, old-timer here, a true old-timer, cowboy, Bill Morgan, used to ride his horse out there to pick up the mail. And he worked evidently for the postal department, because he did handle the mail. And I was, I recall these things because I was impressed with horses and cowboys and big things like airplanes that could do over fifty miles an hour or something. (Laughs) The, there wasn’t the same facilities in those days that there are now. No skating rinks, no motorcycle tracks, no motorcycles to speak of. There’s nothing for kids to do, you made your fun with bicycles, and chased lizards, have sticks, dig holes, build forts, play baseball, football, but that—I remember having as much fun then as the kids appear to have now, you know. Mm-hm. So, as far as specifics, I don’t know; it just seemed as great then as it does now, you know. Yes. Didn’t have the same facilities to play with or no recreation, no street lights. But it was still fun. How old were you when people started driving cars? People was driving cars before I was born. (Laughs) Oh. (Laughs) (Laughs) I’m not that old. Well, were there very many people driving cars around Las Vegas when you were around, when you were younger? UNLV University Libraries Frank Cope 18 Yes. They were driving cars, but not that many. Very, people couldn’t afford cars in those days. I don’t remember my folks even having a car until I was, oh, probably, oh twelve or fourteen years old. Mm-hm. And they had an old Chevy but people just couldn’t afford cars. They didn’t have the money. They just lived and tried to get by—in the area we were in. Now there was on the other side of town, there were more cars. But the traffic was nothing like it is now. Uh-huh. Well, Frank, I know you have to go to your class now. So I won’t keep you any longer. I just want to thank you for giving me this interview. (Tape ends)